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  1. Rivington is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 12:06pm

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     Style: Taijiquan/Shuai-Chiao/BJJ

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Phillips View Post
    OK. I posted this:
    Originally Posted by Me
    You claimed earlier that my performance against Kintanon shows that I was not qualified to critique Zendo's kickboxing.


    and you responded with this:

    Originally Posted by Rivington
    Where did I say this? Oh yes, what's your line again? "Quote or STFU."


    and then I reminded you that you had already said this

    Originally Posted by Rivington
    Simple: you lacked the training experience to come to the conclusions you did about Rene.


    Then I asked you to apologize.
    Ah, I see. You think apologies are just some things dudes do, like fist-bumps or circle-jerks. No, you get no apology, since what you quoted isn't what you claimed I claimed, as I already explained. Your strawman shellgame of pretending that your MMA match was a grappling match so that clearly I can't have an opinion of your estimation of Zendo's kickboxing skills (which again, isn't the issue) was just your bullshit.

    I'll explain one last time: you claimed that Zendo must be pulling a fast one, rather than simply being terrible. You had no way of knowing this—indeed, you just insisted that we must treat him as "average" as opposed to especially bad, or fat, or depressed, or the recipient of training in a country with few expert coaches etc. That is, you insisted on assuming a perfectly spherical cow rather than analyzing the actually existing Zendo. You then transposed the 600 hours of training from its actual post-video commencement to pre-video. Further, the 600 hours includes both kickboxing and grappling styles. (Did you see a lot of 10th planet JJ in that vid? Remember, that was part of the 600 hours too.)

    What you are insufficiently trained to tell is

    a) why it is that Zendo sucked (i.e., is he just awful or was he somehow lying about all sorts of stuff) and

    b) what 600 hours of instruction should have done for Zendo specifically.


    Not c) that Zendo's video is shitty.

    The "conclusions you did [come to] about Rene" are not c—that's hardly even a conclusion, just a universal observation. They are a and b. And it is absolutely so that you are insufficiently trained to come to either conclusions a or b, which was Lebell's point about waiting to see your own video. And indeed, you performed worse than you thought you would, but not worse than Lebell thought you would.
    Last edited by Rivington; 12/16/2012 12:11pm at .
      #2551
  2. Matt Phillips is offline
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    NOTE TO SELF - MOAR GRAPPLE - GET A NORMAL HAIR CUT - REPEAT

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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 1:18pm

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     Style: Novice Sub Grappler

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rivington View Post
    Ah, I see. You think apologies are just some things dudes do, like fist-bumps or circle-jerks. No, you get no apology, since what you quoted isn't what you claimed I claimed, as I already explained. Your strawman shellgame of pretending that your MMA match was a grappling match so that clearly I can't have an opinion of your estimation of Zendo's kickboxing skills (which again, isn't the issue) was just your bullshit.

    I'll explain one last time: you claimed that Zendo must be pulling a fast one, rather than simply being terrible. You had no way of knowing this—indeed, you just insisted that we must treat him as "average" as opposed to especially bad, or fat, or depressed, or the recipient of training in a country with few expert coaches etc. That is, you insisted on assuming a perfectly spherical cow rather than analyzing the actually existing Zendo. You then transposed the 600 hours of training from its actual post-video commencement to pre-video. Further, the 600 hours includes both kickboxing and grappling styles. (Did you see a lot of 10th planet JJ in that vid? Remember, that was part of the 600 hours too.)

    What you are insufficiently trained to tell is

    a) why it is that Zendo sucked (i.e., is he just awful or was he somehow lying about all sorts of stuff) and

    b) what 600 hours of instruction should have done for Zendo specifically.


    Not c) that Zendo's video is shitty.

    The "conclusions you did [come to] about Rene" are not c—that's hardly even a conclusion, just a universal observation. They are a and b. And it is absolutely so that you are insufficiently trained to come to either conclusions a or b, which was Lebell's point about waiting to see your own video. And indeed, you performed worse than you thought you would, but not worse than Lebell thought you would.
    Look, I really don't want to go on and on about Rene because I have no problem with him, and I think excessive rehashing of this stuff is unfair to him. Let me see if I can wrap this up to your satisfaction...

    I'm going to grant, for the sake of putting this to bed, your point that the 600 hour thing was a) outside my ability to apply to his vid, and b) applied backwards in time. That said, it's irrelevant because the stuff in his old bio about being an assistant instructor of Muaythai was sufficient to raise a red flag. Should it have been dropped when he explained that he never was any such thing? Yes. And it wasn't, and I told him I was sorry for the whole mess. And he accepted.

    It's done and there's nothing left to say, and I am not digging up any more details on that episode because i don't want to endorse a thorough rehash. If you're not satisfied with this, and insist on continuing with this, I am simply going to grant you license to label me in anyway you wish.

    He's a good guy, and he's training hard, and this stuff is long over. You want me to be a fanboy douche? That's cool. You can see me in any way you wish and I'm not contesting it. It's your right.
    Last edited by Matt Phillips; 12/16/2012 1:22pm at .
    Now darkness comes; you don't know if the whales are coming. - Royce Gracie


    KosherKickboxer has t3h r34l chi sao

    In De Janerio, in blackest night,
    Luta Livre flees the fight,
    Behold Maeda's sacred tights;
    Beware my power... Blue Lantern's light!
      #2552
  3. Hiro Protagonist is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 1:54pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lebell View Post
    WTF...im really having my blonde moment here.




    Quote Originally Posted by Bling Bling View Post
    So you lied, but you can't remember, so it's no problem? You school of thought, I must burn it down.
    No, but what's done, is done.
    I am not happy about it, but I won't sepukku over it, either.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bling Bling View Post
    Cause you still haven't. Try again.
    Post it twenty times more, please. I am not online 24/7.

    Here's my assessment of your behavior as I described it to Lebell in one of the PMs we exchanged.


    The problem was how his [bad] attitude translates on the mat: He is very hard to work with. He doesn't know how to adapt to a partner, he fouls a lot in sparring, and he doesn't tap out.
    Granted, we could have been clearer with him about that in '11, and especially this year. But in any case, we need to communicate this to him in a civilized fashion, or, sooner or later, somebody will end up seriously injured.
    I'd rather not wade through the TD minute-by-minute, and little annoyance after little annoyance, but that's a general statement that I have made a few times in pretty much the same manner, so don't say that I am exaggerating because I am angry with you, or whatever.

    Just take that, and think about it, so next time things work out in a more relaxed fashion. And guess what, I really wanted to keep this out of the internet narrative.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bling Bling View Post
    memory must be very short. We already have, in person. Remember?
    Yes. And you didn't seem to get it, at all.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bling Bling View Post
    Oh STFU. MAP.com is that way.
    No, not really. There is a difference between being tough, and being mean.
    And that line has been crossed so often by now that the level of the general discourse has degenerated to a point where I am reminded of that image when the schoolboys strip naked and dance around the pighead.

    Like, for example, what does this dramafest in particular really serve? Just one thing really: EuroMega 5 will be really awkward, when it should be enjoyable.
      #2553
  4. Matt Phillips is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 2:26pm

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     Style: Novice Sub Grappler

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you don't want to roll with someone at a TD, you just DON'T ROLL WITH THEM. If you find yourself on the mat with someone who is hurting you, tap out. If you don't want to tap out, then SUB HIM. If you can't sub him, and he's hurting you, and you don't want to tap out, and you don't want to concede that he is better than you, then you have a major ego problem, and deserve to have it smashed out of you.
    Now darkness comes; you don't know if the whales are coming. - Royce Gracie


    KosherKickboxer has t3h r34l chi sao

    In De Janerio, in blackest night,
    Luta Livre flees the fight,
    Behold Maeda's sacred tights;
    Beware my power... Blue Lantern's light!
      #2554
  5. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 2:42pm

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     Style: xingyi

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bling Bling View Post

    Besides, I think Omega and IIF said earlier something about not culling this thread JUST BECAUSE.
    Really? Just because? I guess you read none of the announcements, that were posted by Phrost, a few months ago?
      #2555
  6. Azatdawn is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 2:45pm


     Style: Thaiboxing; MMA nööb

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hiro Protagonist View Post
    Just one thing really: EuroMega 5 will be really awkward, when it should be enjoyable.
    I was actually trying not to get involved in this, but I have to wonder this very small thing: is this something that can get done with by means of a very honest fisticuff, followed by a handshake and agreeing to disagree?
      #2556
  7. Tranquil Suit is online now
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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 3:08pm

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     Style: Getting fat.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hiro Protagonist View Post
    Here's my assessment of your behavior as I described it to Lebell in one of the PMs we exchanged.
    Interesting... so that's how you did 'damage control', as Lebell put it.




    Quote Originally Posted by Hiro Protagonist View Post
    The problem was how his [bad] attitude translates on the mat: He is very hard to work with. He doesn't know how to adapt to a partner, he fouls a lot in sparring, and he doesn't tap out.
    Granted, we could have been clearer with him about that in '11, and especially this year. But in any case, we need to communicate this to him in a civilized fashion, or, sooner or later, somebody will end up seriously injured.
    First of all, we didn't spar. Let's just get that out of the way.

    What were your reasons for not sparring again?

    Day 1: "Oh, my neck hurts. I hurt it yesterday. I gotta let it heal first." I'm not 100% but I think you used the word 'whiplash'
    Day 2: "Oh I just busted my knuckle... Ah I can't punch"

    Listen son, I have a guy in my gym who once broke his face (orbital bone), sparred anyway, he put on a helmet and asked me to go light.
    Another guy, now ex-pro, had a tumor removed, lost his hearing in his left ear. Still does combos, teaches kids.
    Even I have frequently dislocating shoulders which I have to pop back in. That's no big deal.

    So then you say **** like this, and you still wonder why I have a 'bad attitude' when I have to listen to that bullshit.


    Second, lemme first repeat I'm a total noob just like you, but that one time that I leterally let you sit on me and do an Ezekiel choke. ****, you were pushing on my chin, dumbass. I tapped when I FINALLY felt a choke.

    hpr says that I spazz. I'm a zero noob, what can I say. Against you thou, not so much.


    Oh yeah, we sparred 2 minutes under restricted Savate rules, ultra light, under supervision. I literally stood flatfooted still, leaned foward and waited for you to throw punch. CHEERLEADING YOU TO DO IT, while weaving my head. Whenever I would throw my hands (not even punch), you'd jump away 2 meters and turn your back.

    And then you still have the nerve to tell me I'm hard to work with. FUUUUUUUCK





    Quote Originally Posted by Hiro Protagonist View Post
    Yes. And you didn't seem to get it, at all.
    You mean when you decided to give me that HOURS long monologue in the middle of the night about how to live my life. I was just lying there, scared to move a muscle. That **** was awkward as hell. ****, and I thought I was full of myself.

    And then you call me a disturbed person... lol




    Oh you don't like when I say this **** in public?
    Well I don't like when you allude to made up **** in public. I also certainly don't like when you 'do damagecontrol' by talking about me behind my back.



    Now how about explaining this:
    Quote Originally Posted by Hiro Protagonist View Post
    However, I am not willing to do that in a hostile environment, or against an opponent I can not trust to behave like an adult when it comes to questions of safety. Which was a fairly big issue this year already, by the way.
    Cause you still haven't.

    (tab) Forum > Forum Actions > General Settings > in Thread Display Options > Number of Posts to Show Per Page: 40
      #2557
  8. Tranquil Suit is online now
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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 3:33pm

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     Style: Getting fat.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Azatdawn View Post
    I was actually trying not to get involved in this, but I have to wonder this very small thing: is this something that can get done with by means of a very honest fisticuff, followed by a handshake and agreeing to disagree?
    You mean like a *gasp* GONG SAU ??

    Well Rafe still has Matt on his GS agenda. Unless he's withdrawing his challenge, ie dicktucking.

    (tab) Forum > Forum Actions > General Settings > in Thread Display Options > Number of Posts to Show Per Page: 40
      #2558
  9. Azatdawn is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 3:42pm


     Style: Thaiboxing; MMA nööb

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bling Bling View Post
    You mean like a *gasp* GONG SAU ??

    Well Rafe still has Matt on his GS agenda. Unless he's withdrawing his challenge, ie dicktucking.
    Not really a gong sau I don't think. I just think that this is past the point where talking can help. You know, just a semi-friendly beating to get it out of the system. I dunno.
      #2559
  10. bobyclumsyninja is online now
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    :)

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    Posted On:
    12/16/2012 4:25pm

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     Style: Ex-Tiger KF, ex-SanDa

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I made hiro a lowlight. Wasn't going to put it up if he went to train, buuuuut.

    Hell I wouldn't have even made it, but on rewatching Hiro/TS mma, I couldn't resist.

    Possibly tonight I'll put it up. No shame in not being good, but Hiro should have been far more forthcoming about his utter lack of ability.
      #2560

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