Hedgeangelion 2.0: We Are [Not] In A Parking Lot (w/ video)

[mike321]

Antifa,

So you agree with me about getting people's opinions from them instead of relying on somebody else. (did you think I was making an accusation that you don't listen to the other side?), you obviously put your experiences as the only legitimate experiences, don't know what to tell you about that. And twenty years as an activist and three yrs as a civil rights clerk, I could easily dismiss that with some rhetoric and blind myself to other peoples' experience but what's the point? I am from the suburbs which seems to indicate all sorts of stuff to you, ok then, I don't have issues with where I am from. I guess I am not worthy for discussion to you. I don't think I am understanding your branding argument correctly but I will spare you any follow up questions. It's been interesting.

[Antifa]

Antifa,

So you agree with me about getting people's opinions from them instead of relying on somebody else. (did you think I was making an accusation that you don't listen to the other side?), you obviously put your experiences as the only legitimate experiences, don't know what to tell you about that..

Well... yes.. my concrete observations and experience are more valuable to me then your wild speculation without much actual knowledge.

Why should I base my life on a stranger's theories when they contradict my lived reality?

And twenty years as an activist and three yrs as a civil rights clerk, I could easily dismiss that with some rhetoric and blind myself to other peoples' experience but what's the point?

Thats what you pretty much did. You keep dismissing facts with rhetoric, and then call the facts rhetoric. And call rhetoric facts.

Your not blind to my experience. I opened your eyes. its just that once your eyes are open you still really just dont give a ****.

I am from the suburbs which seems to indicate all sorts of stuff to you, ok then, I don't have issues with where I am from..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_hegemony

This is why you think immediately to encourage recoupment and cooptation the instant the legitimacy of any institution is challenged. Because this institution most directly benifits you and the social strata you are from while being highly unlikely to face you with of its negative impacts.

You have loyalty to the instituion (brand), you identify with it, it provides you a service at a cost you can bear and you are happy. You believe that this institution, because it benifits you, and will respond to citizen preasure because it values you as a citizen.

However, if you are approach a problem from a place where you are not participating from a space where you have completely internalized a ruling class http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weltanschauung and/or do not have the race/class/gender/orietation/gender presentation background to be allowed as full citizen participation, you can rightly expect that "the pig system"(tm) to not be as responsive to your cries.

I guess I am not worthy for discussion to you.

You havent discussed anything. You said to someone in portland... go work the with police. I said nope, policing as an institution is riddled with racists ad fascist. With a specific case from Portland.

You then said well gosh, you guys should join the police force because you will somehow change things.

You said this despite every indication in the case sited, which you didnt believe until it was clear, that leadership within that institution will normalize that institution in it's own interest and not in the interest of people participating in that institution in order to change it.

I don't think I am understanding your branding argument correctly but I will spare you any follow up questions. It's been interesting.

And then again with the culturally superior paternalistic bullshit. It hasnt been interesting because you havent learned a damn thing.

[Hedgehogey]

Anyway back to the original topic, hedge how did you take the guy down the first time you've already got him mounted when the video starts. I was hoping it was some fancy sumi geashi?

Just your standard vanilla double leg, as i'd already dropped to one knee from his initial sucker punch.

I've started to question and wondered if grappling is really as an effective method of self defence as I once thought. Surely a hard striking art would be better as it more offensive and grappling more defenceive?

I was gonna lambast you but then I saw your style field. Instead i'll let you consider that in light of this video and of the difference between slappy arm punches and hitting someone with an entire planet.

[Hedgehogey]

So your irrational hatred of Nazis has nothing to do with their violence? You hate them because they gather quietly in basements reading my fight and having discussions. yea
http://edition.cnn.com/2007/US/09/24/us.iran/ No gays in Iran apparently.

I don't live in Iran. The only time anyone's tried to queerbash me here in the states was an attack by a white, presumably Christian or Atheist Ron Paul drone. And I live in a non-state with a high proportion of Muslims.

[mike321]

And then again with the culturally superior paternalistic bullshit. It hasnt been interesting because you havent learned a damn thing.

Sorry to disappoint.

[erezb]

I'm sorry to hear that, i realy am. I won't say you have an irrational hatred because the rational is your experience with those low lives, try to understand that people have their own experiences in life, ill take your word that those people are fucking evil (even though i never met one), you take mine that the people i was talking about are just as evil. The fact that i wasn't attacked by nazies ever does not make me think that you guys are irrational, though your friend sounds like a caricature of an underground activist.

[Hedgehogey]

You read like a 15 year old on a youtube comment page.

[Antifa]

you take mine that the people i was talking about are just as evil.

Okay I'll bite.

So... out of all the evil in the world, all the injustice that you can think of an read about, you just got to bring up fundementalist Islam, in a place that's far away.

And rather than concern yourself with things going on where you live, you are going to throw stones at people for not being all over something going on literaly on the other side of the globe.

I'll just put that down for a minute.

If say... I suddenly became motivated to struggle against fundementalist Islam, I'd have some choices.

I could in some way support any number of sides in any number of wars... although the people where I live are most likely to be involved in some aspect of the GWoT.

Or.... I could, as an Anarchist does, organize horizontally, get in touch with people FROM places where Fundementalist Islam rules. Then, I would support the basebuilding social projects that allow actual practical resistance to Fundementalism.

For instance, if I wanted to fight the Taliban, instead of say enlisting, I'd pump money and support into these people:

http://www.rawa.org/rawa.html

Who have been resisting in Afganistan since 1977. They have always been secular, anti-sexist and modern. They have never recieved a drop of support from the US, despite the fact they are very much nation builders.

They fought the Monarchist Fundementalists.

Then they fought the Communists.

Then they fought the warlords.

Then they Fought the Taliban,

Still Nobody gives a ****. But hey... these people are against all the things you hate about Islam, and they are up in the Taliban's asshole, teaching women to read..... Hmmmmm.....

Dont get me started on what to do about fundementalist Iran

[adouglasmhor]

Mainly because irrational hatred of Muslims for being 'violent' (imagine the hypocrisy of that on a site that proclaims itself "home of the world's smartest violent people" in the tagline) has nothing to do with the video or even of me indirectly. A Muslim has never attacked me or any of my friends for our sexuality, gender, color...actually for any reason at all. Fascists have. I have no need to train to fight against attacks by marching Wahabbis in the USA for the same reason I don't have to avoid getting trampled by fucking unicorns.

Once when I was postering for an AFA meeting I found some local Pakistani/British/Muslim men were tearing down the posters after i put them up.
I got talking to them and it was a cultural mix up over Imagery and language. The language issue was partly between Weedgie and English not Urdu and English though. "Get the Racists out our Communities" was misunderstood as they were unfamiliar with the word racist, (so much for those who say it gets used to often by minorities) and though it meant the same as races and in Weedgie Community Centre gets shortened to Community (as in “I am going down the community”).
The imagery was because the poster had a swastika on it. But that was easier to explain as they all got the insult of a shoe breaking it when it was pointed out.
I have to say I was not attacked, just asked WTF I was doing (and not in aggressive way) and warned some of the younger guys might be a bit more hot headed and not ask questions first. But it is more likely the younger guys would have understood the language and imagery a bit better.
Not exactly this but I can't find the classic image used with a woman's shoe smashing the krankenkreuz.

[erezb]

I'm there. We don't have too many Nazis here (only nazi supporters muslims) And it is a big issue, in all aspects of life. Im not sure you would have the balls and\or ability to stand up to them when they are the majority or even close to that.