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  1. mike321 is online now

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    Posted On:
    7/06/2012 7:44pm


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Even more important to stay engaged then. Law enforcement must report to the citizenry. The amount that this is true varies greatly around this country. I think this is more important than street brawling.
  2. Mr. Machette is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/06/2012 8:21pm

    Join us... or die
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antifa View Post
    yeah... and now he teaches a leadership class.
    Makes sense. Nobody has a greater appreciation for hierarchy than fascists.
    Last edited by Mr. Machette; 7/06/2012 8:24pm at .
  3. Antifa is offline
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    Sin Dios! Sin amos!

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    Posted On:
    7/06/2012 8:30pm

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     Style: Starting Over... Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by mike321 View Post
    Even more important to stay engaged then. Law enforcement must report to the citizenry. The amount that this is true varies greatly around this country. I think this is more important than street brawling.
    you just made me sad....

    Exactly how would you stay engaged and hope to do something about this. This guy has been a known nazi on the force since 1999. In 2003 he and his squad beat up some demonstrators. This cost the force 300K. In 2004 he was promoted.

    The Chief stood up for him in 2007. In 2010 he was finally essentially fined 2 weeks pay.

    In 2012 he teaches leadership as a Captain.

    My comrades did a full report on institutional support for him here:

    http://rosecityantifa.weebly.com/1/p...rk-kruger.html

    This report contains information on how local police silenced civil-rights groups who worked with them on this issue, causing them to remove statements from their website.

    What good exactly does "engagement" do?
  4. mike321 is online now

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    Posted On:
    7/06/2012 10:46pm


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

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    Antifa,

    From my observations from the suburbs where policing in my opinion tends to be more in tune with its citizens:

    Drop the comrade, lefty, class struggle, minority oppression, etc. I probably don't agree with your politics but that's not the point. It's a big turn off to many people and you need the community to take ownership of the police force.

    Keep it boring. Is traffic properly enforced in Portland? Are pedestrians safe? Are police safe when they pull over people? Is backup close by? What about crime rates? Are people being victimized by criminals? Is there a non emergency system for contacting police quickly and easily. What is 911 response time? How are they managing their budget? Do they have the resources to do their job? Is mutual aid agreements in place to maxine cooperation with surrounding cities?

    Encourage people of high character to apply to the force. Many of my friends went into law enforcement. I respect them and not coincidentally they avoided crappy departments. Encourage friends not to give up on your city.

    Finally, engage local government and once again focus on boring: street upkeep, budget, education, permitting, sewers, park upkeep etc.

    Also, please don't be offended by the politics comment. I may be characterizing you completely wrong, but even if you are super lefty I would not want you out I the system. Once again, the boring stuff is key for local politics.
  5. adskibullus is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/07/2012 2:50am


     Style: Lifting heavy stuff

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    Quote Originally Posted by judoka_uk View Post
    Getting people together and shouting at people separated from you by 4 lines of police, dogs and crowd barriers doesn't require great intelligence. If it did the EDL would all be card carrying members of MENSA.

    They're idiots, because they claim and or believe that:

    A. They are some how society's only bulwark against fascism, which is so fucking loltastic I'm not sure I can express its ridiculousness in words.

    B. That being a middle class white boy and having a brief slap and scrap with a working class white boy, before the police breaks you up. Is some how hardcore. Middle class white kids in shemaghs getting into scraps with working class white kids in leather jackets is not the defining conflict of our age, nor does it actually achieve anything. Other than giving Tarquin a good story to tell to his fellow middle class mates in the squat in Kensal Rise.


    Did they bollocks.

    You know what the majority of the British public see when they watch UAF v s EDL on the news?

    A bunch of fucking hippies who need to get a job vs a bunch of fucking retarded northern monkeys who need to a get a job.

    The other thing is that non of the fucking idiots in either the EDL or UAF realise is how ideologically close they are. The only thing that separates the EDL and UAF is foreigners. Apart from that they both want nationalisation of industry, an overthrow of the banks, common ownership of the means of production, workers collectives etc...

    The EDL is the working class expression of frustration and angst at perceived inequalities in capitalism. The UAF is the middle class expression of frustration and angst at perceived inequalities in capitalism.

    That's why they're both idiots and I have no real time for either.
    You're making some sweeping generalisation here, who says the EDL are all working class. I bet in there ranks there are plenty of the middle class are just as racist in their opinions as the working class , have you ever read the daily mail it's full off anti immigrant bollocks. It's just the middle class in the EDL ranks probably just pump the money into it rather than stand at the demos.

    Also who says the UAF are middle class? I'd say me and my family are working class, I grew up in the areas where we lived side by side and made good mates with people from different ethnic back grounds, that why I hate it when do called English defence league try to tell me that my Muslim friend who I've known all my life needs to gett off our streets. I don't do it because I'm a jobless hippy.

    Surely getting out and doing something and voting with your feet is better than sitting at home moaning about doing nothing?
  6. Cullion is offline
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    Everybody was Kung Fu fighting

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    Posted On:
    7/07/2012 3:28am

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    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    You're making some sweeping generalisation here, who says the EDL are all working class. I bet in there ranks there are plenty of the middle class are just as racist in their opinions as the working class , have you ever read the daily mail it's full off anti immigrant bollocks. It's just the middle class in the EDL ranks probably just pump the money into it rather than stand at the demos.
    I suspect j_uk has a different definition of 'middle class' to you. I expect there are very few, if any, middle class people as j_uk would understand the term involved with the EDL.
    Last edited by Cullion; 7/07/2012 3:38am at .
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  7. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/07/2012 6:13am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    You're making some sweeping generalisation here,
    That is the game we're playing right? After all you said that the UAF was responsible for 'more moderate Britains' understanding what the EDL are, pretty sweeping, pretty general.

    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    who says the EDL are all working class.

    Also who says the UAF are middle class?
    @1:24 is a nice little comparison.



    On the EDL side Burberry caps, England football shirts and bomber jackets on the UAF side prescription lenses, shemaghs and Dorothy Perkins duffle coats.

    Of course the higher organisations of both are reliant on money from very wealthy people. Chris Wentorth for the likes of the EDL and the trustafarians at the Socialist worker's party for the UAF.

    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    have you ever read the daily mail it's full off anti immigrant bollocks.
    You're doing a Harriet Harman and conflating opposition to immigration with racism. They are not one and the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    I'd say me and my family are working class, I grew up in the areas where we lived side by side and made good mates with people from different ethnic back grounds, that why I hate it when do called English defence league try to tell me that my Muslim friend who I've known all my life needs to gett off our streets. I don't do it because I'm a jobless hippy.
    Your personal circumstances don't override the reality of the character of the EDL movement any more than using myself as an example of someone who went to public school, but who hasn't joined the UAF overrides the character of that movement.

    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    Surely getting out and doing something and voting with your feet is better than sitting at home moaning about doing nothing?
    What do you think does more to aid the EDLs cause?

    A: Them holding a march attended by a few hundred people which is tightly marshalled by police and passes off largely without incident, thus generating minimal news coverage,

    B:The UAF turning up to counter protest. Thus an entire county's police force being deployed to separate two baying mobs hurling projectiles and abuse at each other. That shuts down a city centre for several hours generates lots of arrests. Thus being a major news event and attracting lots of local and national coverage.

    Which of those two events do you think is more exciting for the ordinary foot soldiers?

    A: You sit around in the pub talking about how Pakis are taking all the jobs and that someone needs to do something about. So you organise a march to do something about it and all that happens is you stroll through the streets with some placards shouting whilst the police watch on. Then you go back to that pub and carry on talking about how Pakis are taking all the jobs.

    B: You sit around in the pub talking about how Pakis are taking all the jobs and that someone needs to do something about. So you organise a march to do something about it. On it there are loads of these 'liberal paki loving scum' shouting abuse at you. You and your mates can now see the enemy. You can join in the chanting. You can hurl stuff at the enemy. The adrenaline is pumping. You get to do this for several hours then you go back to the pub and you get to swap stories about how Kev lamped some speccie twat or how you lobbed a rock and it knocked one of their placards out of their hands.

    Which do you think is more likely to build solidarity amongst groups of disaffected young men searching for a sense of identity and self-worth? Which do you think is more likely to see them build friendships and stay in the movement and go on more marches?
  8. adskibullus is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/07/2012 8:10am


     Style: Lifting heavy stuff

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    Quote Originally Posted by judoka_uk View Post


    You're doing a Harriet Harman and conflating opposition to immigration with racism. They are not one and the same.
    It is when its based on the colour of their skin or because of their faith. The whole immigrants taking my job line is bollocks aswell, its not the immigrants they should be blaming its the government.

    British industry has changed over the years meaning not as many low skilled workers are needed. Meaning higher education and knowledge of technical skills is more important as you cant just leave school with nothing and get a job down the mines or in factories like you used to because covernments both tory and labour have killed industrial Britain.

    But the education system is poor and doesnt equip young people with the skills needed to suitb the changing industrial landscpe. too many young people who arent acedemic get fustrated, misbehave develop a bad attitude and leave school with nothing then cant get a job.
    Instead of blaming the unfair system they take it out on the nearest brown person this needs to change and the organisations ( BNP/ EDL) who brainwash these people need to be erased.

    Quote Originally Posted by judoka_uk View Post
    Your personal circumstances don't override the reality of the character of the EDL movement any more than using myself as an example of someone who went to public school, but who hasn't joined the UAF overrides the character of that movement.
    True that was a bit of a straw man i my part.

    Quote Originally Posted by judoka_uk View Post
    What do you think does more to aid the EDLs cause?

    A: Them holding a march attended by a few hundred people which is tightly marshalled by police and passes off largely without incident, thus generating minimal news coverage,

    B:The UAF turning up to counter protest. Thus an entire county's police force being deployed to separate two baying mobs hurling projectiles and abuse at each other. That shuts down a city centre for several hours generates lots of arrests. Thus being a major news event and attracting lots of local and national coverage.

    Which of those two events do you think is more exciting for the ordinary foot soldiers?

    A: You sit around in the pub talking about how Pakis are taking all the jobs and that someone needs to do something about. So you organise a march to do something about it and all that happens is you stroll through the streets with some placards shouting whilst the police watch on. Then you go back to that pub and carry on talking about how Pakis are taking all the jobs.

    B: You sit around in the pub talking about how Pakis are taking all the jobs and that someone needs to do something about. So you organise a march to do something about it. On it there are loads of these 'liberal paki loving scum' shouting abuse at you. You and your mates can now see the enemy. You can join in the chanting. You can hurl stuff at the enemy. The adrenaline is pumping. You get to do this for several hours then you go back to the pub and you get to swap stories about how Kev lamped some speccie twat or how you lobbed a rock and it knocked one of their placards out of their hands.

    Which do you think is more likely to build solidarity amongst groups of disaffected young men searching for a sense of identity and self-worth? Which do you think is more likely to see them build friendships and stay in the movement and go on more marches?
    The problem is the police dont marshall the events properly. They shouldn't even be able to hold marches when they display blatant racism, its not a protest its a mini riot.
    in the video you posted you see the EDL kicking off even when there is no UAF presence they have no political agenda they just dont like muslims moderate ones or not and will fight among themselfs.

    I dont know what the aswer is but it seem to me like a counter protest is the best anwer to deal with them. My case point being last years london riots but the EDL being the looters and the UAF being the police.

    when the riots first started the police stood back to little action apart from observing the trouble hoping it would fade away. As more looters saw that they could get away with it more joined in and things got worse. Then when the police decided enough was enough and showed some force the rioters got scared and backed off and the trouble ended.

    If thousands and thousands of UAF turn out against the EDL, the EDL will run back to their pubs and hide in fear knowing that the british public wong stand for them. Also it will be in the polices best interest just to ban them from marching and their pointless racist views will be kept in dingy pubs and internet forums. job done
  9. Vieux Normand is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/07/2012 8:56am

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    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    I dont know what the aswer is...
    Of course you do.

    Just get a "wormtongue" to infiltrate your local nazi chapter and have him get their leader all obsessed with beating the Russians on Russian soil.

    Worked last time.

    As for cops keeping these two sides apart---why?

    The only thing the cops need to do is tase both sides into paddy-wagons, get all those mighty combatants to the nearest football field, arm both sides to the teeth and then lock the gates.

    Drop some food and water once a day (maybe) into the field from choppers as long as there are survivors. Once both groups have done the human gene pool the favour of mutual elimination, you won't even to need to do that any more.

    Final touch: once they're done, dump the remains of members of both sides into the very same mass grave.

    The battle-hippies and jackboot-babies get their died-while-fighting glory.

    The cops get something useful to do, rather than keeping apart people who should be doing us the favour of killing each other.

    We are rid of all of them.

    ...and maggots get something to eat.

    Win-win all around.
  10. adskibullus is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/07/2012 9:03am


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    Quote Originally Posted by Vieux Normand View Post
    Of course you do.

    Just get a "wormtongue" to infiltrate your local nazi chapter and have him get their leader all obsessed with beating the Russians on Russian soil.

    Worked last time.

    See the lefties allways win!Q
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