The only issue would really be for guys like me who might want to comete but don't want to pump their bodies full of **** in order to do so. If you're pro I get it, you're going to do whatever it takes to win because your paycheck is at stake. I don't care if pros juice, come on we all fucking know their doing it anyways.
But it would suck balls if at the hobbyiest level you had to juice in order to stay competitive.
If you're not cheating, you're not trying.
Originally Posted by Stu-Jitsu
"Your body must be like a stone, your mind... like a meatloaf."
Originally Posted by strikistanian
Originally Posted by Devil
Originally Posted by dflanmod
D-Flan, this isn't directed at you so much as the "Let the pros do what they will" attitude.
I've been gone for a while, but the long-coming dirty test from Overroid has given me some fire in my belly.
I hear on all the MMA sites I follow (here, junkie, playground, cagepotato) "50% to 98% of all fighters do it, so why bother testing or punishing them?" or something similar. This is SO wrong.
I've been fighting for 6 years now, and work statewide with professional fighters out here on a daily basis. Let me tell you, not a SINGLE one is juicing. All these fighters claiming otherwise are either trying to rationalize their own use, or are hanging out with the wrong guys. I was talking about this with my training partner Juan last night, and we both agreed that if our opponents were taking PED's, it would only be fair if we were allowed a weapon.
I just wanted to throw this out there, cuz I know at least 100 fighters, and NONE take illegal substances to help train. That's bullshit, and only fucking pussies do it.
The integrity of the sport is FAR more important than the average fan getting to see their overly muscular, post-puberty pimply, shrunken ball piece of **** super heroes get in the big show and PRETEND to be as good as they seem.
The one thing I will say is that the Government has done a tremendous job of filling people with BS myths about PEDs.
Does it matter to you if teh substance is illegal or not?
Originally Posted by Tramirezmma
Im genuinely inetrested.
For example, if your opponenet had been supplementing with Jack3d, One More Rep, Spirodex, basically a supplemet that was not illegal or on the banned substance list but did offer physical benefits....would you still be happy to compete with him or would you consider him to have an unfair advantage?
Do you draw the line at Illegal Substances, substances that are not illegal but are on the banned list, or any substance that offers an "unfair advantage"....(although not sure how you would quantify an unfair advantage.
Let pros take what they want, period.
Simple fact that roids or PEDs doesn't magically grant skill so it not "cheating" like the ignorant claim it is so if they want to push their bodies to the limit let them.
Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!
Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
I don't have a problem with established supplements, like creatine, protein, and the like. We can all get it, though I choose not to use anything beyond protein shakes from Advosomething.
Originally Posted by ZenMMA
My position is that there is a list of banned substances, it is easy to read, and we all know it exists. So if it's not banned, go nuts (though this opens the door for the unscrupulous companies who just slap a new name on some banned **** and try to market it as legal until they are found out.)
For the most part, things that are not banned have a more established track record of not killing people, and not having the transformative effects of steroids. If myself and another fighter are working equally hard in the weight room, but he gets 3x my results cuz he has a needle in his ass...that's bullshit.
Already long story short-the rules are the rules, and there is no justigying trying to get around them. Taking banned substances is more fucked up than trying to soccer kick a downed opponent in a Pankration match, IMHO.
Oh, so it's not deliberately breaking the rules in order to gain an advantage? Good to know.
Originally Posted by Gezere
It may not magically grant skill, but it can grant the kind of strength that a fighter could never attain on their own, which can mask a distinct lack of skill, ala Overroid.
You may know a bunch of fighters that claim not to use PEDs but how many of them are top tier Pros? If we were to really take a hard look at professional and high level sports (football, baseball, triathletes, olympic level sports), I'm talking about unbiassed outside peer reviewed science. How many of the best are taking some sort of PED or have taken them in the past?
You don't have an issue with supplements but who draws the line between supplement and PED? As for my assumption about athletes taking PEDs? Let me ask you this. How many drugs would you take if it meant you would go from middle of the pack to front runner and that difference would mean millions of dollars? Sort of the difference between third string and starting lineup in the NFL.
It's human nature to push the envelope in order to win and even more so when you start involving money.
And let's not even go down the road of I'm clean for my piss test.... Put all of these pros on a polygraph and ask them about ANY PRIOR USE. What the **** do I care if you piss clean now but spent 2 years bulking up on PEDs? That's no better than the guy who couldn't piss clean.
As gezere says. Let the pros do what they want. At least that levels the playing field and returns the intellectual honesty to the game and we can all stop arguing over the merits of a persons wins.
PS. Yes I know a polygraph is blahblahblah..........
To play the devil's advocate: there are plenty of things that don't magically grant skill that are still cheating. I'm struggling to think of ANY form of cheating that magically grants skill, except for sandbagging I guess.
Originally Posted by Gezere
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