Lead leg round-house

[Chen Zen fromFA]

All kicks are telegraphed in the same way as all punches are telegraphed:
If you know where to look, your opponent will not surprise you on a 'single technique attack". With punches, it are the shoulders that telegraph the motion.

Well single technique is largely what we have been discussing, right?

It's a game of timing, range and set-up that will deminuish the time of the visible start of any technique and its impact. That's why strategy, combo's and set-up in hand-2-hand combat were developed.

Agreed.

The darkend letters have absolutely nothing to do with a style being a "power" style or a "speed" style.
It's the process of generating the impact force in a "kickboxing" style that defines a style as a "power" or "speed" style.

Savate is a pure speed style, yet it is a part of the French Militairy h2h system.

The force of Muay Thai is generated by a combination of speed, technique (swinging the leg basebat style) and torque of the hip. While it comes over as a power style because of the use of the shin as the striking area, the power generation is build upon speed.



Solar plexus isn't part of the stomach area...at least not in Europe.

"Swinging the leg like a baseball bat" Sounds like power.

I wasnt aware that anatomy changes over seas. The solar plexus, is just above the stomach and below the ribs. Its the weakest set of muscles in this area and why so many arts target it in their torso strikes.

Timing and Range make the differance here: why would I wait until my opponent is in striking range before starting my counter attack? Timing would suggest that I start my counterattack when my opponent is just outside my teep range, but proceding toward it, so that impact is accomplished at the maximum distance from me, thus giving me some "breathing space".

From what you said here, it sounds like what I said earlier "Taking advantage of directional committment"I wasnt suggesting waiting on him to get in your range, what I was suggesting is that you give him the advantage of directional committment if this is used other than as a "stop hit" due to you coming forward with the kick.

[Permalost]

Well single technique is largely what we have been discussing, right?

I dunno, its kinda like discussing what part of a car is most important- difficult to talk about in isolation, because its the relation to other things that is important.

[Chen Zen fromFA]

In sanshou, roundhouse kicks were some of the most commonly caught kicks that ended in successful takedowns, in my experience at least. Of course the low ones are not caught often though, but they present their own problems. My old sifu drilled us to throw a right cross immediately as a low kick defense and if it landed while the other guy was on 1 foot and kicking it was awesome.

In TKD, I cant recall a single time my roundhouse was caught, but I can think of plenty of others that did, like my front kick, side kick. I even got caught in a spinning back kick. So our experiences differ in this matter. Which isnt surprising giving the style differences. Theres a good chance our build is different as well, and all of these things play a factor. The cross example you gave, Ive seen done a few times. I wonder why you dont see it more in competition. I also wonder what lead you use and your opponent is using. I use a right hand lead. Dominate hand forward.

The triangular footwork isn't only forward. Its also backwards at 45 degree angles. Stepping back this way forces the other person to adjust their position to face you properly, so you sometimes get a moment where you can land your kick. This is actually a typical thing in karate and kung fu, using the cat stance or whatever you want to call it, where stepping on one of these angles gives you a good target to kick if the opponent steps in to attack.

Im glad you said this. This is the one time I use a front kick the most, as Im stepping back, so as to keep the opponent back, or to stop his counter. For me, Its almost never a forward moving/stepping motion. I really would like to say never, but theres no definates to defense.

If you do a side kick and step forward to hit with your rear hand, your body will have to shift all the way from an angled position, basically turning it into a haymaker, whether it be with the fist or whatever. Sure it'll hit hard if it lands, but haymaker motions are notorious for not landing. And this is coming from a guy who did choy li fut for years, a style known for its haymakerin'. From the front kick position, the body is in a more neutral position so both hands can be brought into play. Or, if you perfer, both hands can come into play if you use trapping + striking at the same time.

From the way you describe, that sounds correct. If you kick and THEN step, but that wasnt really what I was saying. The step is done DURING the kick, as it comes off the ground. When the foot is on it way to the ground after impact, the rear hip begins to torque forward and you release a straight punch. The position it leaves you in is very similar to a karateka's front stance and the punch will resemble his reverse punch. Its not high percentage unless the kick failed. If the kick landed its likely that you will knock him out of range for the punch, but if he blocks or evades, then the punch usually lands, or at the least, keeps him from getting too close.

And I agree, the front kick does leave you in a more suitable position, as far as stance, and ability to strike. Its just undesirable for me to be DIRECTLY in front of an opponent. Both kicks leave you this way, and so I rarely use either. My post earlier wasnt meant to imply that the side kick or the position it leaves you in to be a BETTER option, just that it can be an option.

From a side kick, I think its better to follow with the lead hand, even if you want to follow that with the cross, cause why not? Doing a side kick and following it with the rear hand is missing an opportunity.

I agree, and I didnt mean to imply otherwise. Why have the gap in time between attacks?

[Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs]

I wasnt aware that anatomy changes over seas. The solar plexus, is just above the stomach and below the ribs. Its the weakest set of muscles in this area and why so many arts target it in their torso strikes.

Can someone with a medical background help me?
Solar Plexus isn't known in the Dutch language, so I can only find English texts and pictures.
It looks to me like that it's the midrif or at least a part of the midrif.

If it's part of the midrif (the zone between the long cavity and the intestines cavity), then here it's considered as the lowest part of the chest (because it's associated with breathing and not digestion).

BTW, by "stomach" area for the teep, I meant the belly area around the navel, not the solar plexus.

[ChenPengFi]

CZ is an ignorant idiot, that's the problem.

The solar plexus doesn't really exist.
The "celiac" plexus is a cluster of nerves and related vasculature in the abdomen, and is sometimes called the "solar plexus" by lay people; yet since he typed:

Its the weakest set of muscles in this area

He's clearly talking out of his ass, as usual.

[Chen Zen fromFA]

You're a real dumb bastard arent you? You act like you know so much, yet every post Ive ever seen you make is just to talk ****. As arrogant a prick as you are, if you could have disputed anything I said you would have, which leads me to believe you know less than what you elude to. So does your post. As you mention its "Commonly" called the solar plexus and the ab muscles that protect this area (Just under the Sternum) are the weakest of your ab muscles. Why dont you get off of Fake's dick long enough to go learn something before you get embarassed, boy?

[Chen Zen fromFA]

Can someone with a medical background help me?
Solar Plexus isn't known in the Dutch language, so I can only find English texts and pictures.
It looks to me like that it's the midrif or at least a part of the midrif.

If it's part of the midrif (the zone between the long cavity and the intestines cavity), then here it's considered as the lowest part of the chest (because it's associated with breathing and not digestion).

BTW, by "stomach" area for the teep, I meant the belly area around the navel, not the solar plexus.

Rene, Hope you didnt take it personally, I just reread it when I read your post and I didn't mean to offend.

In the arts Ive studied, just below the sternum has always been the optimal point for torso strikes.

The strike you mention is considerably lower, so I understand your position on the earlier posts a little more clearly. Is there a reason you choose this area to strike? Being this low it would seem to me that you might as well go for a groin strike. This would reduce the risk of the kick being caught, if thats the reasoning behind the location of your kick. Is there more to it than that?

Humbly
CZ

[ChenPengFi]

You're a real dumb bastard arent you? You act like you know so much, yet every post Ive ever seen you make is just to talk ****. As arrogant a prick as you are, if you could have disputed anything I said you would have, which leads me to believe you know less than what you elude to. So does your post. As you mention its "Commonly" called the solar plexus and the ab muscles that protect this area (Just under the Sternum) are the weakest of your ab muscles. Why dont you get off of Fake's dick long enough to go learn something before you get embarassed, boy?

No you simply can't read.
The celiac plexus is nerves, not muscles.
The solar plexus doesn't exist.
The lay people, like you, are wrong.

Anything else?

edit: I could correct your grammar etc, but that would be tedious, seeing as how you write like an illiterate teenager... Oh wait... Never mind.

[Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs]

Rene, Hope you didnt take it personally, I just reread it when I read your post and I didn't mean to offend.

If I was offended you would read language that would make a sailor blush.

In the arts Ive studied, just below the sternum has always been the optimal point for torso strikes.

Kidneys, liver and spleen make better targets than a nerve bundle behind an organ/underneed the diafragma for striking or kicking.
Whilest painful when contact is made, it's a very small target to hit when using fists and feet since they are also relative small.
Personally a horizontal knee attack, preferably "jumped" or from a decent clinch position would be better.

The strike you mention is considerably lower, so I understand your position on the earlier posts a little more clearly. Is there a reason you choose this area to strike? Being this low it would seem to me that you might as well go for a groin strike. This would reduce the risk of the kick being caught, if thats the reasoning behind the location of your kick. Is there more to it than that?


Humbly
CZ

The "family jewels" are hanging between the legs, two very strong parts of the body (muscle and bone), that are very mobile and can take impact. Which make them great shields.

The belly at naval hight is a big target. It's located at the height that your leg is almost at an angle of 90° (give or take a °) for impact, which gives you the longest reach.
It's all soft tissue (muscles and intestines) so your foot will go deep into it. While the kick is already painful at impact, the compression of the intestines will put inside pressure on all the organs and nerve bundles. So your opponent gets an instand second pain wave of the stomach, liver and the celiac plexus, not so intens as a direct hit, but painful enough to back off.

Also an opponent is usually aware that groin strikes (by kicks) and roundhouse kicks to the lower torso are/can be involved in initial combat, yet a lower abdomen teep is/can be a surprise.

[Chen Zen fromFA]

Related plexuses

Approximate location of the celiac plexus on the coronal plane



The celiac plexus includes a number of smaller plexuses:

• Hepatic plexus
• Splenic plexus
• Gastric plexus
• Pancreatic plexus
• Suprarenal plexus

Other plexuses that are derived from the celiac plexus:

• Renal plexus
• Testicular plexus / ovarian plexus
• Superior mesenteric plexus
• Inferior mesenteric plexus

[edit] Clinical significance


Lower half of right sympathetic cord


The celiac plexus is often popularly referred to as the solar plexus, generally in the context of a blow to the stomach. In many of these cases, it is not the celiac plexus itself being referred to, but rather the region where it is located. A blow to the stomach can upset this region. This can cause the diaphragm to spasm, resulting in difficulty in breathing—a sensation commonly known as "getting the wind knocked out of you". A blow to this region can also affect the celiac plexus itself, possibly interfering with the functioning of the viscera, as well as causing great pain.
A celiac plexus block by means of fluoroscopically guided injection is sometimes used to treat intractable pain from cancers[1] such as pancreatic cancer. Frequently, celiac plexus block is performed by pain management specialists and radiologists, with CT scans for guidance. Intractable pain related to chronic pancreatitis is an important indication for celiac plexus ablation.


From Wikipedia, for your benefit Pf Chang. Read the first line below the 2nd picture. "The celiac plexus is often refered to as the solar plexus, generally in context to a blow to the stomach"

But you're right, it's everyone else who's wrong.