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  1. Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs is offline
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    fist first Philosopher

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    Posted On:
    5/11/2012 5:31pm

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     Style: Savate (LBF/SD/LC) - BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chen Zen fromFA View Post
    In JKD ther is the risk of takedowns, so the hips are never squared, and the toes of the rear foot almost never points toward the opponent.
    Dutch-style Muay Thai also has the hips squared and it's considered one of the best stand-up styles for MMA, because you can Sprawl and Brawl instantly from that position.

    You should give it a try.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jiujitsu77
    You know you are crazy about BJJ/Martial arts when...
    Quote Originally Posted by Humanzee
    ...your books on Kama Sutra and BJJ are interchangeable.
    Quote Originally Posted by jk55299 on Keysi Fighting Method
    It looks like this is a great fighting method if someone replaces your shampoo with superglue.
    The real deadly:
  2. Chen Zen fromFA is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/11/2012 8:11pm


     Style: JKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs View Post
    Dutch-style Muay Thai also has the hips squared and it's considered one of the best stand-up styles for MMA, because you can Sprawl and Brawl instantly from that position.

    You should give it a try.
    Thanks for the suggestion. I have some limited experience with Muay Thai and western boxing. I realize that there are many styles that do this differently, this is simply the way I do it. I dont use a picture perfect textbook form of this stance either.

    There are elements that I dont use, such as the lunging. Bruce did this because he favored the finger jab. This caused him to sink deeper into his stance than I do. Since he did it, alot of OJKD guys do it. I dismissed much of what he did. Keeping true to the JKD ideals, I evolved it to fit my needs. I dont finger jab or lunge outwardly so Im not set as deep as some folks.

    As for the rear foot. The idea is that being pointed at an angle or to the side gives the student more surface area (versus the ball of the foot) in which to grip in the case that his balance is attacked by a hard shove or takedown attempt.
  3. PointyShinyBurn is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/14/2012 4:42am

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     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chen Zen fromFA View Post
    As for the rear foot. The idea is that being pointed at an angle or to the side gives the student more surface area (versus the ball of the foot) in which to grip in the case that his balance is attacked by a hard shove or takedown attempt.
    That's not really how competently executed take-downs work. If your front leg is attacked with a foot sweep or a single leg then bracing on the back one isn't going to help you.
  4. Chen Zen fromFA is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/14/2012 8:48am


     Style: JKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PointyShinyBurn View Post
    That's not really how competently executed take-downs work. If your front leg is attacked with a foot sweep or a single leg then bracing on the back one isn't going to help you.

    Thats true, and prevention plays a big part of that, however, this stance is used quiet a bit by Judoka during randori. Its called "T-ing" up. As a clinch position, its helpful. Theres actually an article on the site about it, that I came across a few days ago.
  5. PointyShinyBurn is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/14/2012 1:02pm

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     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You weren't talking about clinching, though, but about the free-movement phase?
  6. Permalost is online now
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    5/14/2012 2:29pm

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     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chen Zen fromFA View Post
    As for the rear foot. The idea is that being pointed at an angle or to the side gives the student more surface area (versus the ball of the foot) in which to grip in the case that his balance is attacked by a hard shove or takedown attempt.
    A sprinter pushes off the ground to go forward, so there is an equal and opposite force going the other way; braced by the foot so the runner can explode forward. I've never seen a sprinter start with their foot sideways. But you could say that that's a dissimilar example so its not valid.

    Using a perpendicular braced foot to resist a grappling attempt is something I'd force people to do in push hands so I could exploit it. You exploit it by taking advantage of their sideways stance, which is weak laterally and the back can be taken (I've heard that single legs are easier too but push hands mostly just taught me above-the-waist grappling techniques).
  7. Chen Zen fromFA is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/14/2012 8:22pm


     Style: JKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You guys both have very valid points. Heres what Ive got to offer.

    Pointy, yes I was talking about free movement, I simply mentioned the Judo because it is a grappling art that utilizes this position. As such, it would lead me to believe that there is some validity in the use of it against an opponent trying to clinch or takedown. Before any one asks, Im no Judoka so I may be totally wrong in my interpretation of it.


    Permalost. What you mention doing in your push hands is quiet correct.If an opponent is too close and engages in fighting, holding your foot in this manner makes you less mobile,especially to the rear. Again, that falls under prevention. Also, A JKD stance isnt static. Its always moving.

    We are taught Never stand still, never let the hands stop moving,never let the feet settle longer than it takes to attack or defend.

    Also remember that, although at an angle, the side of the hip does not face the opponent, as you suggested.

    One of the very first drills we did, the instructors had us stand feet together, arms at the side. They would give each student a slight push. The student would catch themselves by stepping forward. The hand and foot that went forward was most likely your dominate ones and the position the the students were left standing in became very close to their working stance.

    And finally I offer that, the foot is not at a 90 degree angle from the opponent, if thats what you had envisioned. Its closer to 45
  8. Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs is offline
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    fist first Philosopher

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2012 4:55am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Savate (LBF/SD/LC) - BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chen Zen fromFA View Post
    One of the very first drills we did, the instructors had us stand feet together, arms at the side. They would give each student a slight push. The student would catch themselves by stepping forward. The hand and foot that went forward was most likely your dominate ones and the position the the students were left standing in became very close to their working stance.
    A right-handed person is left leg dominant and vice versa.
    The dominant leg is used more as the support leg than as the kicking leg (yet by training the variables between legs can be more compensated).

    Fighting from a semi-side stance will give you the same problems as fighting from a full side stance (see WTF TKD) if you put the none dominant leg in the front, namely constant switching between stances for performing front leg and rear leg kicks.

    While a side stance with the none dominant leg in the rear will give you enough support to do front leg kicks (push, side and axe) with the dominant leg with a speed benefit and keep the leg also in position for usage as the axes in rear leg round house kicks where the factor is power instead of speed.
    Unfortunally this position will limit your angles of attack because you stand in a hook to your opponent.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jiujitsu77
    You know you are crazy about BJJ/Martial arts when...
    Quote Originally Posted by Humanzee
    ...your books on Kama Sutra and BJJ are interchangeable.
    Quote Originally Posted by jk55299 on Keysi Fighting Method
    It looks like this is a great fighting method if someone replaces your shampoo with superglue.
    The real deadly:
  9. Chen Zen fromFA is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2012 4:01pm


     Style: JKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I must be different than most then, as my dominate leg is the same as my dominate hand,my right.

    Like you mentioned this does limit your angle somewhat, However,in my style of fighting, I am always working to get to the outside of my opponents lead.If he fights like a boxer, (left handlead) then its going to present a problem for him as I travel to my right(his outside). He constantly has to adjust his angle to meet mine.

    We always keep the dominate side forward,for the reasons you mentioned regarding speed. The thinking is that with your dominate side forward, you have your strongest, fastest weapons closest to the opponent. Since the "Weaker"of your weapons are in back they are used mainly for defenseive purposes. Being in the back also gives them more momentum in the event that they have to be used to attack.

    Im sure its far from perfect, and new students, or students from other styles often take some time to adjust to this. Ive used it for a little over ten years now and so far so good.
  10. Permalost is online now
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2012 4:16pm

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     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm more comfortable kicking with my left leg than my right, probably because years of skateboarding has mentally solidified my right leg as my one-legged balancing and pivoting leg (goofy footed). So, I usually use a left/conventional lead with an emphasis on kicking with the front leg.
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