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  1. dwkfym is offline
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    Yours truly

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    Posted On:
    2/11/2012 2:47am

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by creativo View Post
    Ok, so knowing that anybody could take your life and that you could take his makes everybody more polite.

    Makes perfect sense. It's just a bit sad that this kind of permanent threat is perceived as an acceptable way to have a polite society. Sounds more like medieval Japan than civilized western world, but this is a martial arts site after all.
    Have you figured out that people can take your life (and so can you) without guns just fine? I've lived in a country where they did just that, not to mention kidnapping, rape, human trafficking, major drug production, etc. (BTW just to spell it out for you, this would go towards showing that legal gun ownership doesn't have much to do with violent crime rates)

    Quote Originally Posted by creativo View Post
    Of course I am, I live in a first world country where homicide rate is a fifth' of the US's. I don't feel ashamed for it.
    A lot of the 1/5th rate dead people probably has some things to say about that. Especially those murdered with any sort of deadly weapon.

    If I lived in a world that there is no chance that I would ever need a gun, I'd gladly give up my weapons. Sounds like you live close to that world (at least in your head) but good on you.

    We've heard this argument over and over again so I ask all of you to keep this thread on topic, even if it becomes buried in other on-topic threads. I will for one stop responding to this sort of thread. Feel free to start another thread on it.
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  2. JohnnyCache is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/12/2012 11:52am

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "An armed society is a polite society" is BS. For one thing, we've had armed societies before and they never turn out to be that polite.

    Shooting people for being rude isn't polite. Constant fear of censorship via violence isn't polite. Too many people here still - after this place has been open for over a decade - jack off to what they think, and rest assured for the majority yes, it is only think, they can do to people.

    I'm glad you smacked the guy in the mouth. Maybe he'll think a little more before he gets out.

    but the masturbation over if one of you would have had a gun? Give me a fucking break. HE has a gun, you have a gun, you fire shots at each other, one of you dies over traffic, you fire shots over normal **** that will just happen again tomorrow, and that's a "polite society"

    I've carried a gun before. I've pulled it on people. I've had guns pulled on me. It's nothing like most of of you think. And it's not fucking polite at all. It's probably 3 or 4 on my list of the least polite things ever.
  3. thrutch is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2012 11:58am


     Style: Shorin Ryu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache View Post
    It's probably 3 or 4 on my list of the least polite things ever.
    Would listing the others be seen as a derail? I'm genuinely interested!
  4. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/12/2012 12:02pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by creativo View Post
    Of course I am, I live in a first world country where homicide rate is a fifth' of the US's. I don't feel ashamed for it.
    I don't, your country is also approximately 1/5 of our population as well.
  5. JohnnyCache is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/12/2012 12:18pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    I don't, your country is also approximately 1/5 of our population as well.
    it's a relative statistic, not an absolute one. We're terrible about killing each other. Or maybe awesome. I'm not sure which. It's not like I miss the people.

    @thrutch

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  6. thrutch is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2012 12:37pm


     Style: Shorin Ryu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    They're definitely impolite.
  7. dwkfym is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/13/2012 5:30am

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache View Post
    "An armed society is a polite society" is BS. For one thing, we've had armed societies before and they never turn out to be that polite.

    Shooting people for being rude isn't polite. Constant fear of censorship via violence isn't polite. Too many people here still - after this place has been open for over a decade - jack off to what they think, and rest assured for the majority yes, it is only think, they can do to people.

    I'm glad you smacked the guy in the mouth. Maybe he'll think a little more before he gets out.

    but the masturbation over if one of you would have had a gun? Give me a fucking break. HE has a gun, you have a gun, you fire shots at each other, one of you dies over traffic, you fire shots over normal **** that will just happen again tomorrow, and that's a "polite society"

    I've carried a gun before. I've pulled it on people. I've had guns pulled on me. It's nothing like most of of you think. And it's not fucking polite at all. It's probably 3 or 4 on my list of the least polite things ever.
    If I had shot the guy, it wouldn't be because he was being rude. It'd have been because he was fucking trying to kill me or the wife. (i.e. my gun, if I had it, would most likely never have come out)

    While I respect your opinions and such since I've never pulled my gun on a person before, if both of us were armed I don't think either one of us would have tried to escalate the situation. But I do see your point. While the chances are that if I had stayed in my car he'd probably have turned around and gone back in his truck, if he had been stupid enough to smash driver's side window with a rock or something, it'd have quickly turned impolite to the extreme.

    I do have to admit though. A society where a weapon is almost completely unnecessary will be the most polite society.
    Last edited by dwkfym; 2/13/2012 5:33am at .
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  8. creativo is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/13/2012 10:36am


     Style: Judofitness

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwkfym View Post
    If I lived in a world that there is no chance that I would ever need a gun, I'd gladly give up my weapons. Sounds like you live close to that world (at least in your head) but good on you.

    We've heard this argument over and over again so I ask all of you to keep this thread on topic, even if it becomes buried in other on-topic threads. I will for one stop responding to this sort of thread. Feel free to start another thread on it.
    My objection was to the well-sounding and totally idiotic aphorism that an armed society is a polite society; I'm delighted that you headkicked a guy who obviously thought he was the ****, coming in with raised fists and everything. I have no wish to start yet another "guns VS no guns" useless thread on Bullshido. Derail end.
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/13/2012 10:37am

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache View Post
    it's a relative statistic, not an absolute one.
    Yes, I thought was rather obvious by my tongue in cheek post that ciompletely ignores his point.
  10. charlie echo is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/13/2012 12:07pm


     Style: karate, judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by dwkfym View Post
    We drive by a scene of some accident with cops everywhere. Driving slow past some police cars. A guy cuts us off while we're in the right hand turn lane. He tuns into the parking lot we were going to turn on. Wife honks the horn, out comes the middle finger [EDIT for clarification: HE was flipping us off]. I look at him and he comes out of the car. I scrambled out of the car and get in between my wife's car and him.

    Must have been some sort of low level boxer. He comes at me saying "come on! take a shot." I throw up my guard and he goes into this shoulder roll guard. He is a small bit bigger than me and fatter, and lankier.

    I've already turned my fight switch on and I nudge into my range. He reckons me to hit him again and then throws a jab. I duck, jab glances off my forehead (that must have hurt his fist). I can't remember if he followed up with a second jab. He steps back and goes up on a curb, thenI threw a left head kick which landed square. He looked surprised as **** and a bit dazed, and I went in and landed two body blows. I got put in a headlock, which I got out of very easily. At this point I get the feeling that we're just sparring and getting a feel for each other. Either that, or his punches are weak as hell. I sure wasn't going 100% yet. Both flip flops are still on my feet so I start kicking them off.

    Anyways, at that point a witness tells us he is going to call the cops and that we should stop. I think for a moment (I 100% believe I was in the right here) and think about for a second (he has backed off about 2-3 feet) and turn away, saying something stupid like "the next time I see you.."

    There was no visible damage done to either of us, except my right edge of the lip was slightly cut (I barely feel it).


    Self assessment:
    The bad
    1. WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING GIVING OPPONENT QUARTER IN A STREET FIGHT! I should not risk anything and attack 100% at any chance given, which there were a lot. I was also not going 100%.

    2. I fought like I was sparring. I needed to fight like real life. There were no effective self-defense techniques used. Nut kicks, more jabs to the face, takedowns (the headlock was really crappy, I could have very easily grappled with him into knees or a takedown), etc.

    3. Leg kicks and body kicks would have quickly diminished his desire to continue fighting. No padding on shins hurt. (HK was landed with the foot)

    4. I should not have threatened him with a "next time I see you."

    5. He didn't look like the type to be armed, but he could have and the situation could have escalated. Not honking was probably the best course of action.

    The good
    1. I remained very calm throughout the whole thing. It was really just like sparring. If only I can maintain this composure in a ringfight.

    2. No one got hurt over stupid road rage. Cops were not called (wife was about to call them though), nothing happened.

    3. My instinctive assessment that my blade (CA legal emerson knife) did not need to come out was correct.

    Misc. notes:
    Head kicks can work if you know when to throw them. Though a punch, nut kick, everything else would have worked. Train full contact.
    Thanks.

    When you say "head kick" you meant a head high round kick from you're rear leg?

    train with the mind set of unarmed combat: go 100% or enough to knockdown or no go: "karate/MMA is for when you out of bullets (or weapons)"

    Agreed: Train full contact! "CA legal emerson knife" is that a locking folder or a fixed blade?

    If the guy pulled a Glock pistol on you, did you have a plan? You know, when you get out of your car, some witnesses may consider that engaging in fighting, not self-defense.

    I had a driver honk at my truck repeatedly from behind me (I had signaled, ahead of his merging in): I had not reaction, other then looking to see if he pulled a gun or was about to get of the car. (ironically, we we had four unloaded and separate guns in the truck, out of reach). I was wearing my lock blade, but I wonder if a fixed blade would be more effective vs a shooter that approached very close?
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