Clarksville Fight Club - Team Wildside BS sambo and everything else

***Omega Supreme*** · Posted On: 1/20/2012 11:44pm

Originally Posted by Omega Supreme

Whoa wait a minute. Where as you probably have a sound argument, stating SAMBO doesn't have belts is erroneous. I think you may want to clarify your statement.

Originally Posted by Tom Kagan

Lion Knight, Uncle Skippy:

To clarify: No, SAMBO did not have a recognized belt ranking system.

At one time, *one* organization with *some* authority over SAMBO *only* in the United States tried to institute a belt ranking system and self-issued their newly minted rank to many SAMBO competitors and coaches. Their actions went over like a lead balloon at the international level. Consequently and due to other factors, that organization no longer has any real authority over SAMBO.

For whatever reason, *some* gyms in the U.S. which *used to* be under that old organization continue to use that belt system or have instituted their own. Why do they do that? Who the **** knows. Maybe those gyms like collecting colorful things.

SAMBO only has two recognized belt colors: red and blue. Which one to wear is matched to the red or blue kurtka a competitor would wear in a sanctioned match. Their opponent would wear the opposing color.

The only recognized ranking system for SAMBO is based on the old Unified Sports Classification System of the former Soviet Union. It is as follows:

Third-Class Junior Sportsman
Second-Class Sportsman
First-Class Sportsman
Candidate for Master of Sport
Master of Sport
Merited Master of Sport

Master of Sport (MoS) would equate to a nationally ranked champion. Candidate for MoS would be the same at the regional level.

There is also an Honored MoS and a Distinguished MoS rank, too. But, due to 'merited', 'distinguished', and 'honored' in nearly all contexts is the same word in Russian, the rank causes confusion outside of Russia. However, they are honorary titles. In the context of the ranking system, a different word is actually used. These ranks can be awarded to anyone making a substantial contribution to whichever sport in which it is awarded and is not limited in its award solely to the sport's practitioners.

This.

For the record. Yes I have a 3 degree blackbelt in SAMBO. What SSF said is true for the most part; but nobody in my group was given rank. I've done my fucking hardest to make my rank mean something. I've done my hardest to make sure my guys know their rank means something. Anybody that rolls with my guys, or fights my guys knows I don't give this stuff away. SSF you can kiss my ass.

**HereBeADragon** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 1:45am

Belt confusion aside SSF do you have anything to back up your claims with? Perhaps SamboSteve can weigh in on this since you are working with him in some capacity? Who are you btw?

**lionknight** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 2:03am

Originally Posted by Tom Kagan

Lion Knight, Uncle Skippy:

To clarify: No, SAMBO did not have a recognized belt ranking system.

At one time, *one* organization with *some* authority over SAMBO *only* in the United States tried to institute a belt ranking system and self-issued their newly minted rank to many SAMBO competitors and coaches. Their actions went over like a lead balloon at the international level. Consequently and due to other factors, that organization no longer has any real authority over SAMBO.

For whatever reason, *some* gyms in the U.S. which *used to* be under that old organization continue to use that belt system or have instituted their own. Why do they do that? Who the **** knows. Maybe those gyms like collecting colorful things.

SAMBO only has two recognized belt colors: red and blue. Which one to wear is matched to the red or blue kurtka a competitor would wear in a sanctioned match. Their opponent would wear the opposing color.

The only recognized ranking system for SAMBO is based on the old Unified Sports Classification System of the former Soviet Union. It is as follows:

Third-Class Junior Sportsman
Second-Class Sportsman
First-Class Sportsman
Candidate for Master of Sport
Master of Sport
Merited Master of Sport

Master of Sport (MoS) would equate to a nationally ranked champion. Candidate for MoS would be the same at the regional level.

There is also an Honored MoS and a Distinguished MoS rank, too. But, due to 'merited', 'distinguished', and 'honored' in nearly all contexts is the same word in Russian, the rank causes confusion outside of Russia. However, they are honorary titles. In the context of the ranking system, a different word is actually used. These ranks can be awarded to anyone making a substantial contribution to whichever sport in which it is awarded and is not limited in its award solely to the sport's practitioners.

Yes I realize this; I also realize my previous answer was unclear, thanks for laying it out.

**Dr. Sleepless** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 3:19am

I feel inclined to defend the honor of my instructor. so basically, **** you ssf. if you absolutely feel that omega can't give sambo rankings then come over and find out on your own. through me.

**CoffeeFan** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 11:00am

Why does every thread about SAMBO end up being about belt system?

**Tom Kagan** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 1:46pm

Originally Posted by SSF

I am a member of the American Sambo Association and I have written an article for TapouT magazine along with Sambo Steve...

Hey, what a cowinkydink! I'm a member of the ASA too and have pitched in some help on a few chores for the organization on occasion. Other than donating $50/year to help along what I feel is a good cause in martial arts pushed forward by a group of guys who look like they know what they're doing with the means to get it done, what does that mean for someone like myself who isn't a grappler?

**sambosteve** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 2:50pm

OK. I can't reply at length...I am at the gym. I will clarify my thoughts on ranks again later. Or, someone can cut and paste my last rant from the other thread. Again, though regarding in house or antiquated ranks. We are not discussing what they mean to their holders personally, but what they mean in the sambo community generally...which is nothing.

Regarding the article SSF wrote for Tapout, we did no co-write it. I was interviewed for it. I have not seen the finished version, nor did I have any editorial control. So, no, we did not write it together.

SSF, welcome to BS. You need to learn how to present an investigation here, lay out your claims and evidence, so you dont look like a guy just ranting on line.

And, again, I advise everyone to go to our website and read what it means to be an ASA member. Membership in the ASA is not equated with skill, rank, credential, etc. It indicates support in the growth of our community. We try to keep a honorable group and try to monitor as best we can the credentials of our members. But we do not stand behind any such ranking systems...even though some of our members use them (which we strongly discourage).

**sambosteve** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 3:49pm

Originally Posted by CoffeeFan

Why does every thread about SAMBO end up being about belt system?

Because there is none and the folks that use them confuse the situation for those who dont know any better. That fact that this discussion happens over and over again is itself evidence of this.

If someone claimed a black belt in karate, judo, or BJJ, nobody would blink an eye (about the existence of such ranks). But, mention one about sambo and this debate will happen. Why? Because there are no universally accepted ranks. People can rationalize all they want, but in the end sambo black belts mean nothing in the sambo world at large.

Omega, it is not the sambo world that has it wrong, it is the few outliers who contradict the majority.

**sambosteve** · Posted On: 1/21/2012 4:58pm

So, back to the OP.

I feel obligated to post this link about what it means to be an ASA member:
http://ussambo.com/sambo_school_membership.html

SSF, what specifically can you tell us about the person in question?
Who awarded, or sold as you suggest, him his "brown belt" in Sambo?

**SSF** · Posted On: 1/22/2012 5:22pm

Ok, Eric and Mike are from my home town and I know the guys. They never took a Sambo class. Two of their students were on vacation in FL and stopped by Carlos Cummings school and trained a few times. Mike called Carlos about joining his association. Next thing I know, Mike is claiming a Sambo Brown Belt. Turns out he bought it off of another guy in our town who has a club belt. The guy told me he sold the brown belt and a few other belts to Mike's students for $50 each. He said it was the easiest money he ever made. The guy is a friend of mine and I told him what he did was BS. To which he replied "belts don't mean **** and if they are dumb enough to pay then **** them". Problem is, they are soiling the sambo name by teaching BS that they don't know. These are guys that I know personally and I know the BS around them. Sorry if I posted in the wrong section or in the wrong format. I have been a member of this site for a long time but I hardly ever come on here so I do not know the "correct" format of posting that will make Omega happy.