Posted On:1/15/2012 11:10pm
"Okay, I'm one of the few that hates the MA=College analogy. It is not the same as getting an uncredited degree."
You're entirely correct, you don't use belts to get jobs and it doesn't cost you tens of thousands of dollars. The only real comparison is paying for a level of knowledge that in the end you do not possess.
"it is like a Junior College vs a University."
A better example.
There are multiple arts with what many call "kiddie black belts."
I understand this now, but I think organizations which do this should say upfront that these are not 'official' IBJJF belts and that they are recognized only within this academy.
TEACHERS say "if you work hard you can be president."
Valid point, but you aren't paying them to become president and then getting the title of president, only to find out that according to the regulating/official organizations you are not a president.
I am not defending the school as I do not train there or train the style. If it bothers you that much don't go.
I understand that, and I understand that I'm being a bit defensive. I appreciate you answering and responding to my questions as I don't know much about bjj or how individual schools operate. I was initially under the impression that there was some form of universal regulation for teaching and the type of belts you gave out. I didn't know people could just make their own systems up, especially someone as experienced as Pittman. The contract is already signed so my kid will go for the duration of the contract, after that we'll see what he thinks and how he's progressed. Again, thanks for your responses.
Last edited by joejitwho; 1/15/2012 11:11pm at .
Posted On:1/15/2012 11:31pm
Oh I also saw a kid under 10 wearing a red belt (and I want to say an adult as well, but i could be mistaken), which I have now learned is quite an esteemed belt that few people actually achieve due to the time and difficulty. It's not a crime, but seems a bit disrespectful to include this belt to provide another monetary step along the way. Neither the child with the purple or red belt appeared to be incredible, they were better than the other children but had I not seen any belts I would not have immediately realized how superior they were. (Not to put these kids down in any way, they were good, just obviously not worthy of an actual red/purple belt) Then again, I assume if someone who dedicated themselves to bjj walked in and saw the belts being used like that, they would be appalled, maybe not. I don't know how seriously this is taken.
In this video of Royce endorsing Pittman's trial offer, you can see an adult in a blue gi wearing a red belt.
Again, maybe it's not a huge deal, but what do they tell that guy if he goes to compete? He can't wear that right? Looking at Pittmans site again I would say it is misleading to give belts however you please but to also say:
Pittman's Academy has a long standing relationship with many of the top Braziliain Jiu-Jitsu (BJJ) organizations and instructors in the world.
Which implies that the belts awarded are legitimate due to the academy's relationship with the top BJJ organizations. They are not accredited with the USBJJ.
Last edited by joejitwho; 1/16/2012 12:12am at .
Fasten your seat belts, and prepare for lift off
Posted On:1/16/2012 1:23am
Style: Combat Cuddling
I didn't know we had a USBJJ. Honestly I think you're taking it too far. I've personally rolled with two of his blackbelts. It's not like he's teaching crap technique, he's just charging a lot for his instruction. Is it what I think is good for BJJ? No, but I'm not gym owner.
I'd like to once again say I think it's slimy and as a Jiu Jitsu guy I think it's against the spirit of the art.
However, I think it'll be good for your kid to learn some BJJ and roll around. Hopefully someday when he's older and wants to compete you can find the right gym for him. For now though I think it's fine. (minus the whole expensive as balls part)
Posted On:1/16/2012 2:16am
Honestly I think you're taking it too far.
You're probably right, it's just hard to turn off research mode when it starts. I will say that everything I've read about his skills and reviews have been positive. And the two guys I've talked to, Klay and Garrett, were friendly and seemed like good guys. The major issue seems to be his belting system. Can you remove his name from the thread title? This link already shows up at page 3 for him and it's probably going to sound worse than it is if someone only skims my first post. I'm not trying to hurt his business, I still think he should be more upfront but that is his choice.
Last edited by joejitwho; 1/16/2012 2:21am at .
Posted On:1/16/2012 4:30am
Up front? How exactly? I really don't see your issue. It sounds a little McDojoish, but then again I do not know. Websites? I quit an art 6 years ago and I was still listed as an instructor, for the style, 5 years later. So, one website naming the promotion and another not can be innocent enough.
If he claims fifth ask him what he meant. Also, if it is from Machado who cares the length of time? It is under him and unless you can prove something nefarious then let it go.
Posted On:1/16/2012 11:31am
Up front? How exactly?
'I have created my own system of belting and therefore the belt your child receives may not be equivalent to the standard system in bjj.'
Posted On:1/16/2012 11:39am
Okay, you are nitpicking.
Pittman was giving his intro speech/trial to some people.
Again, these are questions you ask the person. The intro is a hard sell and he is trying to get you to join. You being offended by his tactics makes me wonder where you draw the line.
Posted On:1/16/2012 11:48am
Originally Posted by Prone
Can this please be moved? This is nothing for the advanced grappling forum and I don't think it qualifies for an investigation either, correct?
It was moved here by Omega and JMG agreed.
Posted On:1/16/2012 12:17pm
Style: BJJ, wrestling
Missing posts moved here: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=114514
This thread may or may not stay in AdGrap. I'm not the one who moved it here, but I trust the judgement of the person who did.
The situation is a bit complicated for me since Mr. Pittman is a student of Carlos Machado like my instructor, William Vandry. I will probably ask Omega or IIF to moderate this thread in the interest of avoiding the appearance of nepotism.
Shut the hell up and train.
Posted On:1/16/2012 2:32pm
Originally Posted by It is Fake
Okay, you are nitpicking.
Again, these are questions you ask the person. The intro is a hard sell and he is trying to get you to join.
Yes, they are questions to be asked of him, but I needed to do some research about it first so I could properly understand his answer. For instance, he could have explained that he meant he was the highest ranking student of Machado, not the highest ranking person in America, but I would not have known who Machado was.
I understand that I'm coming across as investigating too much, but most of it is me asking questions because I don't know much. Like with the red belt thing, for all I know it's sacrilege to give them out like that and it shows he doesn't care for the art, or it's not a big deal at all. I provide information and links because I don't expect others to do it for me. I have to make specific statements so that someone can prove them wrong or confirm them. I know you think I'm trying to start **** or call him out but I have no perspective on the issue, and I appreciate that you have given me some. You are saying these things aren't a big deal in the sport, which is not something I could have known on my own.
You being offended by his tactics makes me wonder where you draw the line.
My last comment on this. I draw the line at the type of claim you make when you are putting someone in the position to purchase with an immediate hard sale. If I sold cars and told you that this is the fastest car in America and you bought it, and then found out I really meant that it was the fastest car designed by a specific person, I assume you would feel a bit lied to. It may still be a nice car, but you thought you were getting the fastest there was. It's one thing to hard sell an abstract concept like that, this is the best looking car, but to say this car can hit 220 mph and no other cars can even get above 200, you're making a direct claim. The way you phrase your sale matters. Anyways, there's no point in arguing it anymore. I honestly appreciate you taking the time to reply on this matter, my misgivings are much less than they initially were.
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