UFC 141: Lesnar vs Overeem - Nate Diaz vs Donald Cerrone, Phan - Friday Dec. 30, 2011

[Devil]

It's a huge scam. Of all the college players who help propel that multi-billion dollar industry, how many get money in the pros after? They're being ridden, by the schools. They often get stuff anyway from boosters, but it should be above board.

Yeah, I just think the riding goes both ways. I know most of them won't make it to the pros. But their contribution to the team's success is also less. I think when you have a kid who's an average athlete and he gets admission preferences, a full scholarship, extreme leniancy in academic performance, and the awesome experience of being a college athlete in a sport like football, I see it as a wash.

[Eddie Hardon]

Exactly. Have you ever seen a pack of soccer fans? Goddamn drunken, raging baboons.

It's horrible I tell ya.

Sadly, the BBC News item has gone missing, still, CNN has outlined this vital story. Despite Brazil not allowing Beer in their Stadia, FIFA think it a hu-MAN Right. Godammit.

Trebles and Guinness all round, Barman.

http://edition.cnn.com//2012/01/19/s...html?hpt=hp_c2

[bobyclumsyninja]

Yeah, I just think the riding goes both ways. I know most of them won't make it to the pros. But their contribution to the team's success is also less. I think when you have a kid who's an average athlete and he gets admission preferences, a full scholarship, extreme leniancy in academic performance, and the awesome experience of being a college athlete in a sport like football, I see it as a wash.

Average athletes don't really get full scholarships (without ace grades). I don't think they should receive any academic leniency whatsoever, but should be paid for their time, and for sacrificing their bodies for others' entertainment.

There's so much College Football money sloshing around, they should definitely get some of it, as they are the ones doing all the actual physical work, without direct compensation. They still get things, on the sly, but that's fundamentally illogical, to make schools risk suspension for booster hijinks, when there's a giant pile of cash at stake, and everyone but the student athletes are raking it in, legally and in the open.

The reason is the schools want all of that money, that they can get. It's positively feudal, to have these massive events...ticketed events, and the actual players are alone in getting nothing. Total bullshit. They sure as hell pay the coaches.

[Devil]

Average athletes don't really get full scholarships (without ace grades). I don't think they should receive any academic leniency whatsoever, but should be paid for their time, and for sacrificing their bodies for others' entertainment.

There's so much College Football money sloshing around, they should definitely get some of it, as they are the ones doing all the actual physical work, without direct compensation. They still get things, on the sly, but that's fundamentally illogical, to make schools risk suspension for booster hijinks, when there's a giant pile of cash at stake, and everyone but the student athletes are raking it in, legally and in the open.

The reason is the schools want all of that money, that they can get. It's positively feudal, to have these massive events...ticketed events, and the actual players are alone in getting nothing. Total bullshit. They sure as hell pay the coaches.

As far as average athletes not getting full scholarships, you can't really have it both ways with your argument. If they're more than average for a college athlete they have the opportunity to win a job making millions of dollars a year. If they're not good enough to get that attention from pro scouts, then they're an average college athlete. If they're an average college athlete they're getting as much from the school as they're giving in my opinion.

They're not sacrificing their bodies for other people's entertainment. It's really not that noble. They're playing because they find it fun and personally rewarding. People get hurt doing **** they like for fun all the time. I'd bet a year's pay you've done so yourself.

To your point about the schools getting all the money, it's no different than any other enterprise where money is involved. The people who lay out the cash, organize the events and take the financial risks are the people who make the most money. Nothing insidious or unusual there.

I think the reason for our differing views is that fundamentally you view their participation in sports as work or some sort of service they provide which they should be compensated for. I view their participation as an awesome opportunity and privilege which should be reward enough in itself. And if it isn't, they always have the option of not playing.

[ChenPengFi]

Unlike most, I've met Overeem in person. He showed up at a rally to support the legalization of MMA in NY state.

I'm not going to speculate on his chemical intake, but he's rather unassuming with regards to his bulk. The TV really does distort the body by adding more weight to the viewer's perception.

Regardless, fans speculating on steroid use/abuse is stupid. Chemicals don't really help with a key fighting attribute: you still need the timing to make contact.

While i agree with almost everything you posted, PEDs can help you recover which means you can spend more time in the gym.
If you spend that time on, well, timing, it's pretty obvious where you'll see gains.
The idea that PEDs can't help your skillsets is silly.

[Hiro Protagonist]

Just to put this soccer thing in perspective:












And then we have...

[Syphilis]

Having tutored college athletes, I am still of the opinion that college and professional sports have nothing in common with each other and should GTFO of each others pants.

College football players all expect a free ride for 4 years and then ??? Half of them know they're not going to get picked up, but it is in the back of their undeveloped mind. For four (more*) years they get idolized and fawned and treated as gods on college and in certain bars. With their undeveloped because they never ever had to do any school work / learn to critically think or anything, they forget that they're not going to get picked up and in four years theyre broke and unemployable with a fake degree.

And the college made $$$$ of their back giving very little in return. Instead of helping these players prepare for their future with an education, they make the education so unnecessary for these 'stars' that they might as well ignore the going to college part altogether, passing them through classes that they couldn't in any real fashion, pass. Colleges down right forget their part of the deal, to be honest in educating their players.

Not all players happen out this way, but when I tutored I had at least a dozen players like this, who weren't going to make it and who couldn't even read a basic sentence to save their life.

*They had the same treatment in High school, so another 4 years of not learning, but apparently, all the kids going to high school waste their time for 4 years in the USA. . .

[Tom Kagan]

While i agree with almost everything you posted, PEDs can help you recover which means you can spend more time in the gym.
If you spend that time on, well, timing, it's pretty obvious where you'll see gains.

You need to recover when training conditioning. You don't need a heck of a lot of recovery to train timing. Additionally, the major component of recovery from timing training (neurological) is mostly unaffected by Category III controlled substances.

The idea that PEDs can't help your skillsets is silly.

I was kind of wondering how long it would take for Mr. Strawman to put in an appearance. The first response - whew! That was quick. I'll bet he needs to recover now. What does your experience with anabolic steroids suggest for him to take?

[alex]

where are you going with this? of course roids wont help someones timing, but there are other fairly obvious benefits (and also PEDs, as i imagine you know, can mean a whole range of things other than roids)

[Tom Kagan]

(and also PEDs, as i imagine you know, can mean a whole range of things other than roids)

I know, that's the strawman I referenced. All of the sudden, the conversation went from anabolic steroids to all PEDs and, oh yeah, someone put words in my mouth and inferred I was saying they all made no difference anywhere. But you're right, I do know about PEDs. I take a lot of medicine for my heart. They are the ultimate in PEDs because they keep me from dying.

Where am I going with this? The lulz. People speculating on anabolic steroid use is lulz worthy. People thinking "LOL... hey wait a minute.." with their reaction to something I post is lulz worthy. When they throw in some logical fallacies in their response, it's definitely lulz worthy. And, people thinking I take any of this seriously is also lulz worthy. Throw it all together at even a fraction of the **** I deadpan combined with my non-sequitors mixed with valid points and it's hilarious. I like to argue. I'm pretty good at it. I enjoy at picking at the weakest links of a position. It's funny to me to watch the chain fly apart, occasionally in a spectacular fashion. And when I **** up an argument and get called on it, you guessed it, I find it funny. This isn't a secret. I've even said to people exactly what I was going to do and I still could get a rise out of them... just like the rise I just got out of you. ;-)