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  1. wrapper is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/30/2011 2:31am


     Style: BJJ/Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    During the 1968 protests of the Democratic National Convention in Chicago, which drew about 10,000 protesters and was brutally crushed by the police, 1 out of 6 protesters was a federal undercover agent. Thatís right, 1/6th of the total protesting population was made up of spooks drawn from various federal agencies. Thatís roughly 1,600 people! The stat came from an Army document obtained by CBS News in 1978, a full decade after the protest took place. According to CBS, the infiltrators were not passive observers, monitoring and relaying information to central command, but were involved in violent confrontations with the police.
    http://exiledonline.com/provocateur-...test-movement/
  2. madmonkey is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/30/2011 6:30am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So you are quoting an article which refers to a protest in the cold war era when your government was openly hunting any one with communist influence in a different city involving a department (the red squad) that had most of its activities quashed in court in 1985).

    This article then compares this to OLA protests which itself admits have only had 4 arrests and have been far more peaceful than NY protests and other places and the only agent provocateur who has been positively identified is the editor of a newspaper and thats because he outed himself.

    As I said before paranoia. I
  3. DCS is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/30/2011 7:26am

    Join us... or die
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmonkey View Post
    I suggest you go and talk to some of your local LEO's or better yet go out on a shift with them and see what their job entails, its certainly not always keeping the population under the thumb of "the man".
    Fixed.

    Police role is not only about enforcing the law. It also includes enforcing the statu quo, the "order", when needed.
  4. madmonkey is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/30/2011 8:02am


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    Quote Originally Posted by DCS View Post
    Fixed.

    Police role is not only about enforcing the law. It also includes enforcing the statu quo, the "order", when needed.
    Correct but a better rendition would be enforcing the law and maintaining the rule law under a democratically elected government, not "the man" but the elected people.

    The police must do this fairly and impartially they have to balance an individuals rights against those of the greater public. So a person commits a crime the punishment must be in the public interest. EG a man with mental health problems and without capacity to make his own choices hits out at his carer causing injury. He has broken the law but is it in the public interest to punish him if he lacks the mental capacity to understand what he had done, of course it is not.

    In the case of these protests you will notice that the overiding message from the US police has been to balance the right to protest with the rights of other parties such as the right for people to use a public place or for traffic to move freely on roads.

    One unifying message from the US police has been stay on the sidewalk don't block the roads. Equally the encampments have been removed as they limited access to the park for the general public due to the number of tents but the police have allowed people to return to the parks to protest as long as they do not camp there.
  5. DCS is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/30/2011 8:20am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I was talking about the role of police as institution in general, not about this particular "OccupyX" situation.

    The role of the police is the same in any country be it a western democracy or a third world dictatorship. It's the balance of power between government and citizens/subjects what makes the difference in how police operates.
  6. madmonkey is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/30/2011 8:25am


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    Quote Originally Posted by DCS View Post
    I was talking about the role of police as institution in general, not about this particular "OccupyX" situation.

    The role of the police is the same in any country be it a western democracy or a third world dictatorship. It's the balance of power between government and citizens/subjects what makes the difference in how police operates.
    Apologies I do tend to over answer things
  7. tgace is online now
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    Posted On:
    12/03/2011 5:43am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPdH3wE0_Y&sns=em
    Last edited by tgace; 12/03/2011 5:48am at .
  8. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/03/2011 10:56am

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    Quote Originally Posted by tgace View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPdH3wE0_Y&sns=em
    Well there you go.
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/03/2011 11:31am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Good lord you can't complain about rhetoric and sensationalism when you use it yourself. Sometimes, I wish people would just upload videos and leave the subtitles out of the equation.

    Thanks for the video it adds another dimension to the issue.
  10. patfromlogan is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/03/2011 1:51pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    Good lord you can't complain about rhetoric and sensationalism when you use it yourself. Sometimes, I wish people would just upload videos and leave the subtitles out of the equation.

    Thanks for the video it adds another dimension to the issue.
    Yes the subtitles here are a problem. They show a strong agenda.
    Quote Originally Posted by tgace View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPdH3wE0_Y&sns=em
    Oh, now I get it, those dangerous students chanted, "Let them go." As the caption put it, they "demanded" that... It must have been terrorising for the poor cops! Then the dangerous students sat in a circle and chanted some nonsense about letting the police go if the police would let the protesters go. I would have thought that the police would have burst out laughing. What are the students going to do? Chant and chant some more! That will show those nasty old police!

    Then there's that really scary chant, "You use your weapons, we use our voice!" That's enough to warrant any level of violence, maybe if you're Rush Limbaugh. Then the caption reads, "Watch how easily protesters twist words. The police never said that they were going to shoot protesters." Ah, no intent or prejudice from the video maker there; we have no idea what the police said, and some excitable kids don't exercise rumour control. IT MUST HAVE BEEN A PLOT WITH EVIL INTENTIONS is the unstated assumption of the film maker.
    Then the caption reads, "Now the protesters begin calling themselves children." The obvious bias of the film maker is never more clear than at this point. As far as I can tell, ONE girl says, "Don't shoot your children." Just once, just one person, one excited girl says this. I'd assume that the crowd was too embarrassed to chant this idiocy. The captions are misleading and propagandistic.

    "Some protesters seem intent on antagonizing the police." It's a very good chance that some are agent provocateurs, but if they were acting like jerks, so what? If you swear at a policeman that justifies exactly what? (in my foolish youth I once swore at a deputy and that got me three days in solitary... but at least I wasn't assaulted, the cops, being professionals, not school rent-a-cop clowns, just looked disgusted and locked my ass up). These cops looked like nerds and acted like out of control amateurs. They're in full combat mode, facing coeds with cell phone cameras! Maybe they thought the cameras and Ipods were actually secret weapons?

    Next time the police should just call in napalm.

    UC Berkeley looked way better, just club the **** out of the students. The guy they work out on while he's on the ground is really cute, as is the 90LB Asian girl's beating.
    "Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez

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