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  1. DCS is online now
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    Posted On:
    12/07/2011 11:30am

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    Well, the American republic was not free of wars, slavery and denying civil rights to women (not counting athenian concept of democracy is a bit different from how democracy is understood today).

    But, otoh, "The Democratic Republic of USA" sounds nice... give it a try.
  2. Sri Hanuman is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/07/2011 11:40am

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    Quote Originally Posted by DCS View Post
    Well, the American republic was not free of wars, slavery and denying civil rights to women (not counting athenian concept of democracy is a bit different from how democracy is understood today).

    But, otoh, "The Democratic Republic of USA" sounds nice... give it a try.
    Don't be surprised when the U.S. continent cracks in half and one side picks that up.

    I envision TX becoming a constitutional state where incest is legal, and guns are a form of currency. Duhn mehs weev Tehksus.
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    Dude I kill people for a fucking living.

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  3. Hedgehogey is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/07/2011 5:03pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Tortelli View Post
    You sure? When one looks at the track record of say, Athens on war, slavery, and women's rights...
    Athens wasn't a democracy. Only 20% of the populace could vote.


    "The only important elements in any society
    are the artistic and the criminal,
    because they alone, by questioning the society's values,
    can force it to change."-Samuel R. Delany

    RENDERING GELATINOUS WINDMILL OF DICKS

    THIS IS GOING TO BE THE BEST NON-EUCLIDIAN SPLATTERJOUST EVER

    It seems that the only people who support anarchy are faggots, who want their pathetic immoral lifestyle accepted by the mainstream society. It wont be so they try to create their own.-Oldman34, friend to all children
  4. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 5:59am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hedgehogey View Post
    Athens wasn't a democracy. Only 20% of the populace could vote.
    Neither is the US, only 63.6% of the population can vote.
    http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html
  5. Vince Tortelli is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 9:07am

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    Well, any FUNCTIONAL Model for a democratic government (which the U.S. isn't, we're a representive republic like pre-Julius Rome) is going to have some form of restrictions on the right to vote, the image of two year olds having just as easy access to the voting booth as an adult is...troubling.

    If I remember right, in Athens you had to be a Free, Male, Property Owning Citizen of the City to cast a ballot?

    Also, isn't it some kind of universal law that any nation that has "Democratic Republic" in it's name is a convict on suspicion tanks in the streets dictatorship hell hole?
  6. crappler is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 9:51am


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    Democracy is based upon the idea that more than half the people are right more than half the time.
    -Mark Twain
    "We often joke -- and we really wish it were a joke -- that you will only encounter two basic problems with your 'self-defense' training.
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  7. crappler is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 10:02am


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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Tortelli View Post
    I think you mean it didn't work for the USSR, from what I read in the papers Uncle Vladimir is making a pretty good showing at it.



    Pitiful for 99% of the population perhaps...I'd imagine the 1% ruling class and the guys with guns and jackboots keeping order aren't starving.

    .

    Of course. How could we forget all the tyranical dictators who were overthrown by the power of love and hugs, like Poppa Doc...no.....Idi Amin?...wait, that's not how that went either...Milosevich? Castro? Pol Pot? Saddam?

    As far as I can tell the only governments to fold like a card table before the indomitable power of the human will are the Americans and the English, even the French had to endure a brushfire conflict before they let Algeria go.
    Nice airball, Vince. There isn't a single revolution anywhere that wasn't the result of ideas, communicated. When you find yourself sharing ideas with communists, it is time to pause and consider. Mao believed freedom came from the barrel of the gun too.

    The most stable nations on earth are liberal democracies with free speech and significant rights for citizens. Let's see how long North Korea lasts vs. England. Violence is a wonderful solution for those who have run out of ideas and long for that beautiful black and white world where good and evil meet. But that is rarely what is happening.

    It's fascinating to watch those who claim to believe in meritocracy and freedom become angry once the 99% starts to assert their own class interests. Nothing sounds funnier than a bank president ranting about unfairness.
    "We often joke -- and we really wish it were a joke -- that you will only encounter two basic problems with your 'self-defense' training.
    1) That it doesn't work
    2) That it does work"
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  8. crappler is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 10:04am


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    And each and every one of those dictators was overthrown because they denied basic rights to people, not because people done got der guns and overtrowed gummint.
    "We often joke -- and we really wish it were a joke -- that you will only encounter two basic problems with your 'self-defense' training.
    1) That it doesn't work
    2) That it does work"
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  9. W. Rabbit is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 10:21am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sri Hanuman View Post
    There's no such thing as "end goal." Purely an illusion.

    ....

    Otherwise, prepare for change. Constant, never ending change.
    That's why they call it "revolution". The Constitution itself is an instrument of revolution, which is why it's funny that people still argue that the document should always be interpreted as if it's written in stone, when in fact it has update procedures built right in to it that have been used successfully right up through the 1990's. Why? Largely because the Founders figured a civil, procedural way was better than another bloody purge.

    In fact considering amendments, prior to the 27th, was the 26th in 1971 that led to the current US voting age.

    Which of course, Rick Perry, once the GOP frontrunner, doesn't even know.

    No wonder the 99% are so frustrated. Is it too much to ask that American Civics be a basic part of the average politicians background?
    Last edited by W. Rabbit; 12/08/2011 10:25am at .
  10. Vince Tortelli is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/08/2011 7:46pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by crappler View Post
    Mao believed that freedom came from the barrel of a gun too.
    Joseph Stalin believed Hitler was an untrustworthy maniac. Or, as my poppa would say "Even a blind hog finds a acorn every once in a while."

    There isn't a single revolution ever that wasn't the result of ideas, communicated.
    Insofar as the ideas communicated were "Colonel! Take your battalion and surround the barracks of the presidential guard." I completely agree.

    No matter how much lofty rhetoric was uttered and weighty thoughts were pondered ont he subject, if it wasn't for the Continental Army in 1776 and the United States Army 1861 we'd all be breaking for tea and crumpets and treating black people like live stock.

    What makes a dictator fall is when he (or she) screws things up so badly that significant portions of the military refuse to follow orders or switch loyalties to someone else. Or in the case of Saddam, when the U.S. and England come rolling into his country and drag him out of his spider hole and to the gallows. When neither of those come into play, the dictator continues to dictate (case in point: Fidel).

    Let's see how long North Korea lasts vs England
    In the grand scheme of things, England hasn't been a modern style liberal democracy for very long either. I wonder what will fold first, North Korea or the emerging democracies in Iraq and Afghanistan.

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