221433 Bullies, 3690 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 11 to 20 of 51
Page 2 of 6 FirstFirst 12 3456 LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. gregaquaman is online now
    gregaquaman's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arlie Beach
    Posts
    2,467

    Posted On:
    11/14/2011 1:45pm


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Browning View Post
    incidently Dave, the "suction effect" is unproven. Its not in any of the standard medical examiner guides so just take that with a grain of salt.
    I might see if I can hunt down some pig hunters and see if they notice a difference anecdotaly
  2. Petter is offline

    12th level logic wielder

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    1,964

    Posted On:
    11/14/2011 2:46pm


     Style: BJJ, judo, rapier

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    FWIW, I’ve heard the same thing about “suction” with respect to fullers (longitudinal “grooves”) in swords. Here, it’s clearly a myth: A sword does not have fullers to reduce suction when pulling it out of a body; it has fullers because it’s like an I-beam; it allows you to decrease the weapon’s weight without making it weak, wobbly, or bendy. Perhaps both the fuller design and the myths about its blood-channeling function have been inherited from days of yore.
    [ petterhaggholm.net | blog | essays ]
    [ self defence: general thoughts | bjj: “don’t go to the ground”? ]
    “The plural of anecdote is anecdotes, not data.”
  3. Rock Ape is offline
    Rock Ape's Avatar

    Watch and Shoot !

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,125

    Posted On:
    11/14/2011 3:12pm

    staff
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Browning View Post
    incidently Dave, the "suction effect" is unproven. Its not in any of the standard medical examiner guides so just take that with a grain of salt.
    Hey.. I didn't write that ****.. I just have to repeat it during the lesson.

    I've never (fortunately) had to engage in that sort of warfare hence I have absolutely no experience to speak of however; having seen a sucking chest wound from a soviet 7.62mm round - suction definitely exists within the chest cavity of someone who hasn't yet expired.

    That all said, when you drive a bayonet into the body, the whole kinetic thing along with the fact the blade isn't going to go in and out at a clean (single) angle the whole suction effect is a bit of a moot point, that fucking blade's coming back out, simple as. :-)
    "To sin by silence when one should protest makes cowards out of men".

    ~Ella Wheeler
  4. Rock Ape is offline
    Rock Ape's Avatar

    Watch and Shoot !

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,125

    Posted On:
    11/14/2011 3:14pm

    staff
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Petter View Post
    FWIW, I’ve heard the same thing about “suction” with respect to fullers (longitudinal “grooves”) in swords. Here, it’s clearly a myth: A sword does not have fullers to reduce suction when pulling it out of a body; it has fullers because it’s like an I-beam; it allows you to decrease the weapon’s weight without making it weak, wobbly, or bendy. Perhaps both the fuller design and the myths about its blood-channeling function have been inherited from days of yore.
    Just about the same principle with Japanese swords.
    "To sin by silence when one should protest makes cowards out of men".

    ~Ella Wheeler
  5. Petter is offline

    12th level logic wielder

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    1,964

    Posted On:
    11/14/2011 3:14pm


     Style: BJJ, judo, rapier

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rock Ape View Post
    I've never (fortunately) had to engage in that sort of warfare hence I have absolutely no experience to speak of however; having seen a sucking chest wound from a soviet 7.62mm round - suction definitely exists within the chest cavity of someone who hasn't yet expired.
    I don’t think anyone’s arguing that suction doesn’t exist—the question is whether a fuller actually does anything to reduce it…
    [ petterhaggholm.net | blog | essays ]
    [ self defence: general thoughts | bjj: “don’t go to the ground”? ]
    “The plural of anecdote is anecdotes, not data.”
  6. Rock Ape is offline
    Rock Ape's Avatar

    Watch and Shoot !

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,125

    Posted On:
    11/14/2011 3:22pm

    staff
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    .. I would suggest, when the blade is fitted to a rifle and it is punched into the body with the force and anger required for that form or warfare, it wouldn't matter in the slightest, but, like I say I have no direct experience from which to draw.

    All I can say is that the last three major infantry rifles used by the British Forces - Lee Enfield 303, Fabrique National SLR 7.62mm and the L85A1/2/3 all had bayonets which carried grooves/channels and the instructional material associated with it's use mentioned suction.

    I can't give you a source unfortunately.
    "To sin by silence when one should protest makes cowards out of men".

    ~Ella Wheeler
  7. Gezere is offline
    Gezere's Avatar

    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Rhineland Pfalz, Der Vaderland
    Posts
    10,588

    Posted On:
    11/15/2011 1:38am

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by soldiermedic25 View Post
    And now its not even part of BCT.
    That's a shame because I was fucking AWESOME at it! (And I was the BN's pugel champ!) If we ever run into an army of tires with poles sticking out of them they're fucked!
    \
    Quote Originally Posted by Diesel_tke View Post
    Ha!! That's pretty awesome!! Spend all that time brain washing someone and then send them out into town. I can just imagine the locals going, "oh ****, they must have been doing that Bayonet training again!"
    During the ramp up to the war(s). We had several instances of guys going out on the town and fucking up people because they were still amped up from training.
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
  8. Permalost is offline
    Permalost's Avatar

    pro nonsense self defense

    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    12,520

    Posted On:
    11/15/2011 12:03pm

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Seems to me that a fuller might even do the opposite of the supposed "blood groove" function. Wouldn't adding an additional I beam kind of structure to a blade increase its surface area compared to a conventional design, causing more drag? This would be especially true if the suction issue were true. It does seem better for pulling out the blade without deforming or snapping it.
  9. Rock Ape is offline
    Rock Ape's Avatar

    Watch and Shoot !

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,125

    Posted On:
    11/15/2011 6:50pm

    staff
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My last phase of pre deployment saw us doing bayonet training and for the mist part we got on and did it however I will confess in that some of us SNCO were a little bored. Bearing in mind this stuff is old hat to us. The younger lads were giving it large portions of gusto however one broke his bayonet in an advance, when he pulled it from the dummy he looked at it as if to say "**** that dummy just broke my bayonet" one of the instructors was balling his head off due to the damage, the lad just charged on and shoulder barged the dummy over, then repeatedly stabbed it with the stub of the blade attached to the rifle.

    We cheered him on much to the distain of the staff running the course.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    "To sin by silence when one should protest makes cowards out of men".

    ~Ella Wheeler
  10. Lindz is online now

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Burnaby B.C.
    Posts
    3,006

    Posted On:
    11/15/2011 7:10pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Sounds like he got the essence of the lesson.
Page 2 of 6 FirstFirst 12 3456 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.