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View Poll Results: Is carrying a sidearm without a round in the chamber acceptable, or not?

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  • Acceptable

    16 51.61%
  • Not acceptable

    15 48.39%
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  1. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/24/2012 9:44am

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    Quote Originally Posted by tgace View Post
    Most military personnel are far from experts on the topic of handguns.
    That's a very good point.
  2. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
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    Quote Originally Posted by qbe9584 View Post
    Ad Hominem, much? He was a Marine Corps Officer. It made more sense than carrying a bullet under the hammer in a crowd.
    You have to qualify this a little for it to mean anything. Marine Corps Officer could mean anything from Infantry, to linguist, to food service.
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  3. ChenPengFi is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by qbe9584 View Post
    Ad Hominem, much? He was a Marine Corps Officer. It made more sense than carrying a bullet under the hammer in a crowd.
    1. Not an argumentum ad hominem, that was reasoning.
    2. You are using an appeal to authority, see Diesel's post.
    3. You are an idiot too.
  4. BadUglyMagic is offline
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    Posted On:
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    Quote Originally Posted by qbe9584 View Post
    . With double action revolvers, it means you are one trigger pull from shooting, and with an automatic you chamber a round before shooting.

    When did the general population of Korea get machine pistols?
  5. qbe9584 is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2012 5:11am


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChenPengFi View Post
    1. Not an argumentum ad hominem, that was reasoning.
    2. You are using an appeal to authority, see Diesel's post.
    3. You are an idiot too.
    Simply calling someone an idiot is not an argument. It is the definition of a crude ad hominem attack.

    The person who taught me stated that his primary consideration for the gun in the holster was to prevent an accidental discharge. He was a rifle platoon leader in the USMC and served in combat. When the pistol is in hand and you can control the weapon, then you chamber a round. So yeah, that seems like a valid reason to keep the chamber empty when you carry a pistol. When you have a pistol holstered do you keep a round chambered? Doesnt that seem a little dangerous to you?

    You sound like someone who may not be safe with a pistol.
  6. qbe9584 is offline

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    Posted On:
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadUglyMagic View Post
    When did the general population of Korea get machine pistols?
    That was me being lazy with the typing. Semi automatic. I suppose it holds true for automatics in general, but i have to admit, Korea would be a lot more fun if everyone had submachine guns.
  7. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
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    Quote Originally Posted by qbe9584 View Post
    The person who taught me stated that his primary consideration for the gun in the holster was to prevent an accidental discharge. He was a rifle platoon leader in the USMC and served in combat. When the pistol is in hand and you can control the weapon, then you chamber a round. So yeah, that seems like a valid reason to keep the chamber empty when you carry a pistol. When you have a pistol holstered do you keep a round chambered? Doesnt that seem a little dangerous to you?
    What type of holster are you using? What is your experience with them? How often have you seen a pistol of any kind discharge itself while in a holster?

    And since you brought up revolvers. How do you address this situation? Do you leave your revolver completely unloaded until your draw it?
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  8. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/25/2012 8:57am

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    Quote Originally Posted by qbe9584 View Post
    When you have a pistol holstered do you keep a round chambered? Doesnt that seem a little dangerous to you?

    You sound like someone who may not be safe with a pistol.
    Okay, I'm convinced. You are in fact a fucking idiot. You do realize virtually every cop in America carries their pistol with a round in the chamber, right? And they miraculously manage to not shoot themselves. With a proper holster and the proper training, it's a non-issue.

    You're also way off base with your "evidence" from the Marine Corps officer. Keep in mind, he can afford to carry condition 3 because he's got an M-16 in his hands...which has a round in the chamber. The pistol is just a backup.
  9. Vorpal is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/25/2012 9:24am

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    Quote Originally Posted by qbe9584 View Post
    Ad Hominem, much? He was a Marine Corps Officer. It made more sense than carrying a bullet under the hammer in a crowd.
    A Marine Corps officer who doesn't know that most modern double action revolvers have intenal safeties preventing them from being fired without pulling the trigger and that it is not the chamber under the hammer while it is at rest that will be fired when the trigger is pulled but one of the chambers to the left or right (depending upon the revolver). The Marines carry the Beretta M9. This design can be carried safely with a round in the chamber. If you prefer you may even carry it with the safety on in case you "lose it in a crowd". There is no real reason it should be carried without a round in the chamber. The Marines and the Army like to have their guys carry it that way so that when they do have an AD because they were screwing around with the weapon there will be no wiggle room for them to BS their way out of it.
  10. qbe9584 is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2012 9:41am


     

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    [QUOTE=devil;2656276]Okay, I'm convinced. You are in fact a fucking idiot. You do realize virtually every cop in America carries their pistol with a round in the chamber, right? And they miraculously manage to not shoot themselves. With a proper holster and the proper training, it's a non-issue.

    You're also way off base with your "evidence" from the Marine Corps officer. Keep in mind, he can afford to carry condition 3 because he's got an M-16 in his hands...which has a round in the chamber. The pistol is just a backup.[/QUOT


    No, he was in Vietnam and he did work clearing out earthworks. That required a pistol and a flashlight. He was okay with a rifle, but had a platoon to handle most of that. The key here is that he had pistols in an age before reliable passive safeties. To cede the point to the other side, if you have a firing pin block like in glock or a sig sauer, then you can get away with it.

    But nobody here has presented an argument for safety. Except of course that accidental discharges NEVER happen, which puts you into neckbeard territory right there. My condolences when you accidentally shoot someone in the future.

    Accidental Discharge is the number three cause of firearm deaths after suicide and homicide according to the CDC.
    http://www.rightdiagnosis.com/f/fire...jury/stats.htm

    Also, I'm not a law enforcement officer. I am a hobbyist. Most everyone here is. So I will quote the pro's here:

    "Most training ranges will eventually see the “late, great leg shot,” as one instructor described it. This type of ND is usually caused by trying to holster a weapon with your finger still on the trigger. Depending on holster design and placement, this error generally causes a grazing wound down the side of the leg, or sometimes a through and through hole in the strong side buttock. Often, the only permanent damage suffered by one of these officers is hearing the; “jumped up and bit me in the butt-tocks” comments from their co-workers -- usually in the Forrest Gump voice. Clearly, this is a violation of safety rule #3 and the solution is to constantly emphasize the need for a straight finger, except when on target."

    So their solution is a loaded barrel with a light finger. My hands clench when I reach for a gun. I have to extend my trigger finger to operate the pistol safely. So, I cowboy carry, or take the extra step and chamber a round before I fire. I am not fast, but I am safe. I was taught this by an old fella who did ok with a pistol when I was near Quantico. He explained the safety reasons to me and they seem sound.

    Nobody has addressed this except to say that it never happens with the trained police of the US, except the police say it does, even in low pressure situations like a shooting range. And there is no way I am getting anywhere near the range time a cop can get while I am in Korea. Keeping the chamber empty is a valid way to combat accidental discharge. Accidental discharge happens. I'm not saying keep the gun unloaded in the holster, but let's not pretend we're all Buffalo Bill King of The Singing Cowboys and shoot ourselves or someone else by accident.
    Last edited by qbe9584; 1/25/2012 9:44am at . Reason: typos
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