WTFdance class?

**Gabetuno** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 1:35pm

Originally Posted by W. Rabbit

I'll say this just once so hopefully people won't complain about it. If anyone troll it I'll just not respond because we all know where it leads. But FWIW...

Instead of taking dance lessons, learn ONE moderately difficult traditional form (come on...do CMA), and make that your practice "dance" routine. If nothing else, you'll get something a little more martial than non and who knows, you might even find a new useful technique (for you) in the form.

Not saying Salsa or the Tango won't help you, but I think you'd be happier learning a form (just one...come on...be brave...it won't bite).

Agility, grace, strength, and flexibility are all improved through dance in the same ways they are improved through regular forms training. This is one of the more useful elements of certain types of forms training, particularly the circular, nonlinear types.

Regardless of how you feel about the utility of forms (and of course that differs depending on what style we're talking about), you can't deny that modern wushu is some of the best competitive "dancing" there is.

Taking that idea a step backwards to non-wushu kung fu, those "finer" points of movement and body connection that come with dancing are also clearly there in the forms.

Case in point: I have always been a very terrible dancer my whole life, but since I began learning some of my kung fu forms, I've improved significantly on the dance floor...another way of saying I no longer look like Frankenstein myself, but now a lot looser, with much more deliberate motion, better footwork, and more than anything, more precise movement when changing directions/circling.

I don't really disagree with your suggestion, but I think it might be more easy to find a legitimate dance instructor in my area. I'd rather get dance lessons than support a local McDojo so I can learn forms.

**Cannon_6** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 2:04pm

I guess I misread this:

...So go ahead and unload your thoughts, criticisms, and general mockery. No quarter will be asked. Or given.

I also failed to acknowledge that dancing is an advanced striking technique.

I do apologize. Carry on.

**Snake Plissken** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 2:16pm

"Dance Class" isn't all created equal. Something like the suggested swing dance (I think I read jnp did that for awhile) and salsa (which Teh El Macho did/does) have very quick fast movements which will translate to quicker foot/leg/hip movement.

Something like traditional ballroom dance is going to have a much different set of skills which got along with it. You will still get added benefit from the learning to shift weight and mass forward and backward and sideways in a refined and delicate manner, but it will depend upon what skillset you are looking to pick up.

Both will help you be lighter on your feet but, for you, what are you wanting to do with your new "non Frankenstein feet"? But quicker with in and out side to side motion or feel lighter with more control and have gliding motions?

**Lu Tze** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 2:17pm

Dancing can't hurt, but to be honest there are probably better things.

Can you skip? I mean skip like a boxer? For more than 30 seconds? Learn to do that.

You should also incorporate footwork into all of your pad and bag drills, don't just stand in front of the fucking things wailing away like it's Rocky's stupid face and you're Ivan Drago.

Oh yeah, and shadowbox like a ************... I don't mean "do 5 minutes for warm up, and then **** it because I look stupid and feel awkward". I mean, like a ************.

If none of that works, go do the Tango.

Edit: I know this is basically "take moar boxing", but **** you and the tap dancing shoes you walked in on.

Wait, tap dancing... that might work.

**Permalost** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 2:34pm

Not saying Salsa or the Tango won't help you, but I think you'd be happier learning a form (just one...come on...be brave...it won't bite).

-CMA forms will tend to teach an exaggeratedly low and wide stance, while salsa will teach to keep the feet close so they can move fast.

-knowing a form is infinitely less applicable with the ladies. Be brave and learn salsa.

Originally Posted by W. Rabbit

Agility, grace, strength, and flexibility are all improved through dance in the same ways they are improved through regular forms training. This is one of the more useful elements of certain types of forms training, particularly the circular, nonlinear types.

I found kung fu to hinder my attempts at salsa, because I was used to having a wide, low kung fu stance, and its exactly how you can't move in some types of dance. FMA on the other hand, teaches dance forms that apply to Latin dance well. The carenza, for example.

Regardless of how you feel about the utility of forms (and of course that differs depending on what style we're talking about), you can't deny that modern wushu is some of the best competitive "dancing" there is.

I'd deny it, and dance experts would agree with me, but that's neither here nor there regarding traditional forms.

Taking that idea a step backwards to non-wushu kung fu, those "finer" points of movement and body connection that come with dancing are also clearly there in the forms.

Some may be, some obviously are not.

Case in point: I have always been a very terrible dancer my whole life, but since I began learning some of my kung fu forms, I've improved significantly on the dance floor...another way of saying I no longer look like Frankenstein myself, but now a lot looser, with much more deliberate motion, better footwork, and more than anything, more precise movement when changing directions/circling.

Learning hung gar to get better at dancing is like learning dancing to get better at hung gar.

**W. Rabbit** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 2:41pm

Originally Posted by Gabetuno

I don't really disagree with your suggestion, but I think it might be more easy to find a legitimate dance instructor in my area. I'd rather get dance lessons than support a local McDojo so I can learn forms.

You could always go the DVD route especially if you don't want to spend money on dancing lessons...I bought a tango DVD years ago and it was decent enough that I was able to learn some basic steps and tried them out on the wife. It was enough to impress her...if only just a little...but that definitely paid off later ;)

There is a decent history of pro and non-pro American sports players who learn ballet and other forms of dancing as "radical training methods"...old Slate article discussing a Sports Illustrated article on this exact subject:

http://www.slate.com/id/2124158/

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...uts/index.html

Even Yoga is mentioned, which is another possibility (and usually cheap and taught at many gyms).

**W. Rabbit** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 2:51pm

Originally Posted by Permalost

-CMA forms will tend to teach an exaggeratedly low and wide stance, while salsa will teach to keep the feet close so they can move fast.

There are plenty of hung ga form sequences that don't do the low/wide stance thing...they rise, fall, open, close...and at full speed those low wide stances are just transitional ....they're not sustained for more than a split second before you're out of them. We really only use the exaggerated versions for static endurance footwork exercises...our forms are way more fluid than that, and at full speed you move through them so quickly you learn do go from low-high, high-low, in-and-out, up-and-down very quickly, and that's where the more graceful, efficient motion started to kick in (At least for me, YMMV).

Originally Posted by Permalost

Learning hung gar to get better at dancing is like learning dancing to get better at hung gar.

It was a fringe benefit I just wasn't expecting.

But anyways if he doesn't want to do forms it's understandable. Too much overhead in trying to find a decent enough instructor, whereas you can tell right away if someone can Salsa or not.

The SI.com article I posted above is a GREAT resource, you can see what kind of "radical dance training" pros are using and generally, both they and their coaches are loving the results.

**Gabetuno** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 3:07pm

Originally Posted by Cannon_6

I guess I misread this:

I also failed to acknowledge that dancing is an advanced striking technique.

I do apologize. Carry on.

Please emphasize the bold.

No quarter will be asked. Or given.

Just because you hopped on here with an obvious comment and then a shitstain opinion doesn't mean nobody is going to call you on it. Welcome to Bullshido. Apparently 4 years of lurking has taught you ****-all.

And I'm sure you fail at a lot of things. This is more than likely not the first time.

**Gabetuno** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 3:10pm

Originally Posted by W. Rabbit

You could always go the DVD route especially if you don't want to spend money on dancing lessons...I bought a tango DVD years ago and it was decent enough that I was able to learn some basic steps and tried them out on the wife. It was enough to impress her...if only just a little...but that definitely paid off later ;)

There is a decent history of pro and non-pro American sports players who learn ballet and other forms of dancing as "radical training methods"...old Slate article discussing a Sports Illustrated article on this exact subject:

http://www.slate.com/id/2124158/

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...uts/index.html

Even Yoga is mentioned, which is another possibility (and usually cheap and taught at many gyms).

I won't add to the "dur I just lurn3d it from utoob" crowd. I refuse. If you want to get good at something, learn from a qualified instructor in person. This IS Bullshido. ;)

And yeah, I'm a big fan of Pumping Iron. While Arnold worked diligently at his ballet, Franco blew it off and Lou hulked along. As a result, The Governator was posing 3-1 with his comrades. I'd bet ballet was especially the difference between him and "The Bat" in the final.

In short, I'm totally open to "alternative" methods.

Edit: Thanks for the article. That was a good help.

***WhiteShark*** · Posted On: 9/19/2011 3:48pm

I guess if you have unlimited time then sure take a dance class. BUT if your goal is simply to improve your footwork for fighting I'd do some drills that people with good footwork tend to do.

I was actually in the same boat as you for a while because my first instructors were very traditional muay thai coaches and they only taught the feet on railroad tracks thai march footwork. Then I got my ass handed to me by a guy that was moving backwards the whole fight and I was well and truly confused.

My coach at that time was a black guy that was built like and moved like Anderson Silva. He had me do footwork drills at the end of every class for a year. If you are interested in drills instead of dance classes let me know and I'll post some stuff.