1. #1

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    6
    Style
    Folkstyle wrestling
    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Chokes: blood flow, pressure, or both?

    Hi yall, yes this is my first post and Id like to say this site is way better than S-h-e-r-d-o-g. Im not a member there but have been reading from the shadows for a very long time in both and the discussions here always seem to start and end better than "there".

    Anyway, I hope this isnt against the rules to ask this here so please spare the flaming as I didnt think it fit better anywhere else. I love BJJ and it looks so interesting, although I havent got around to getting to really learn it as I graduated HS last year and have been more focused on wrestling(135lb), plus the lack of income kinda limits me. Im joining the military though so hopefully Ill get to learn atleast some of the basics and get some money to start practicing/competing in it.

    So, Ive read/researched as much as I can find on how chokes REALLY work and how they do what they do. Some say the decrease in flow triggers the reaction, others say the change in pressure causes it, and yet others say it is caused by changes in flow and blood pressure.

    Basically, I have heard two general sides, one says the carotid artery cannot be compressed by hand/with arms and whats happening is the jugular veins are whats being compressed causing blood to kind of not be allowed OUT of the brain and hence the change in pressure. The other side says the carotid is compressed as well as the jugular overall stopping most flow.

    http://judoinfo.com/chokes.htm

    http://www.judoinfo.com/chokes2.htm

    http://www.onthemat.com/articles/Ana...0_13_2005.html



    Which of these ideas is correct?

    IMO, "its impossible to occlude the carotids with fingers/arm" is wrong. I dont know if the reaction is based on flow, pressure, or both, which is why Im asking, but I think its definitely possible to compress the carotid by hand.
    My reason, your carotids can be felt on the sides of your trachea, they`re the ones that give off the "pulse". If you push really hard directly into your neck with 1 or 2 fingers where the pulsing is coming from, you can feel the pulse start to feel like its getting weaker, hence hindering some blood from going through. And then when you let go, you can most certainly feel a surge of blood rush up through it. Of course, if you do it to both sides, you slowly start losing your senses, push harder and it will happen faster. (Its probably not a good idea to do this much though as I hear getting choked out alot and not tapping can lead one to become very prone to going unconscious very easily.)

    Sorry for such a long post but I would just like to figure out whats really going on. I think its a combination of the carotid and jugular being compressed and decreasing flow to and from, as well as changing the blood pressure.

  2. #2
    jnp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    8,364
    Style
    BJJ, wrestling
    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Welcome to Bullshido. Your post was auto-moderated because you're new and the post contained more than one link.

    Your question has already been posed in the Advanced Grappling forum. That's one of the reasons I moved your thread to Newbietown. Cue the mantra, lurk more, post less.

    Below is the link to the latest and best thread on this site explaining how blood and wind chokes work.

    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...ighlight=Choke

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    6
    Style
    Folkstyle wrestling
    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yes sir, thank you.

  4. #4
    TaeBo_Master's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    San Antonio, TX
    Posts
    4,007
    Style
    Judo, Jujitsu
    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    JNP has already spoken, and he is much more a grappling expert than I am. And he's given you a link to a thread that likely has all the answers you're looking for. So all I'm going to do is pose the following question:

    Does it really matter? Whether cutting off the carotid to prevent blood from getting in, or cutting off the jugular to prevent blood from getting out... the result is the same. If the opponent is unconscious. Does it really matter?
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