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  1. Cold_Skin is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/17/2011 9:02pm


     Style: Okinawan Go Ju Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Is American MA training too laxed?

    Hi, I'm Jesse, 17, with 11 years of Okinawan Go Ju Ryu Karate Do under my belt. I would be Shodan ranking but due to financial reason I had to leave 1 test before my black belt test. But sometimes I doubt that the "Black belt" means anything in modern day American Karate Training.

    When I first started out in my dojo, it was amazing. We would spar and do form equally, constantly trying to work our practical MA skill. As time rolled though, the Dojo seemed to get more and more lazy, and more and more about the money, Don't get me wrong, the training was really good, but seemed to start more so focusing on competition than street practicality. Kata and Kobudo would be the main basis of the class, and we would spar only 3 times every 2 months or so when I was last there.

    Reason's like this, if a lot of Dojos work like this, is a good reason why a good MA would get there ass beat by a street "washing machine" fighter. If a training is too lax and worried about competing, the student's have a hard time adapting to a real fight. I was like that when I sparred an outside, street fighter who was one of my friends. I was a great fighter, but I was so used to "Start!-Hit!-Stop!" and being stiff and using competition fighting strategy that I didn't do as well as I could have.

    If Dojo's would take a week or so out of training and do pad-less sparring (mouth guard and jock cup are exceptions), and "Practicality Training" MA's would be much better equiped to defend themselves. "Practicality Training" is what my Senpai used to teach, he would show us how to utilize what we know against typical "street fight" techniques suuch as wide hooks( he loved condoning when the OPPONENT used them, made his job easier) and how to defend against them rather than just Straight forward Karate styled punches.

    Please if you've experinced or seen a Dojo that has potential, but is too laxed, POST. And if you agree with "Pratical Training" and Pad-less sparring, please voice ALL opinions.
  2. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/17/2011 9:11pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cold_Skin View Post
    Hi, I'm Jesse, 17, with 11 years of Okinawan Go Ju Ryu Karate Do under my belt. I would be Shodan ranking but due to financial reason I had to leave 1 test before my black belt test. But sometimes I doubt that the "Black belt" means anything in modern day American Karate Training.
    There are many Kykoushin Karate Black Belts that would disagree. There are also some very well ran Karate Dojos where their speicifc BB means something.

    When I first started out in my dojo, it was amazing. We would spar and do form equally, constantly trying to work our practical MA skill. As time rolled though, the Dojo seemed to get more and more lazy, and more and more about the money, Don't get me wrong, the training was really good, but seemed to start more so focusing on competition than street practicality. Kata and Kobudo would be the main basis of the class, and we would spar only 3 times every 2 months or so when I was last there.

    Reason's like this, if a lot of Dojos work like this, is a good reason why a good MA would get there ass beat by a street "washing machine" fighter. If a training is too lax and worried about competing, the student's have a hard time adapting to a real fight. I was like that when I sparred an outside, street fighter who was one of my friends. I was a great fighter, but I was so used to "Start!-Hit!-Stop!" and being stiff and using competition fighting strategy that I didn't do as well as I could have.
    Don't confuse your training with all American or American Karate Dojos.

    If Dojo's would take a week or so out of training and do pad-less sparring (mouth guard and jock cup are exceptions), and "Practicality Training" MA's would be much better equiped to defend themselves. "Practicality Training" is what my Senpai used to teach, he would show us how to utilize what we know against typical "street fight" techniques suuch as wide hooks( he loved condoning when the OPPONENT used them, made his job easier) and how to defend against them rather than just Straight forward Karate styled punches.
    This happens in many schools. No, it doesn't have to be without pads either.

    What you are talking about is aliveness and there are schools that practice that way.
  3. BKR is online now
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    3/17/2011 9:22pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kodokan Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    We "spar" (randori) and do drills against resisting partners every class in Judo.

    Maybe you should start to study Judo ?

    http://www.harrisburgjudokai.org/default.aspx
  4. Kaffe is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/17/2011 9:25pm


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    McDojos are just as global a phenomenon as McDonalds. The US does not have monopoly on suckage.

    And patching up a bad dojo only hides the festering wound. I strongly believe that you would gain a better perspective on the matter if you took up a full/semi contact sport like boxing or bjj, even if only for a short time. It might even make you reassess your need for "street practicality".
  5. Cold_Skin is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/17/2011 11:49pm


     Style: Okinawan Go Ju Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I was actually thinking about doing Judo or BJJ and Aikido or aikijutsu. I'm still young, and I was thinking about taking a broad range of classes. Since I have a Karate base already I thought I would go with more grappling or throws for my second art. Like, I know I'm going to get bashed, A LOT, but I have this thing where if I train in something even if I don't like and become decent in it, I'll have a better understanding on how to handle it in a fight. And the whole McDojo thing erally disappoints me, it makes me feel like my training is somewhat meaningless. In case you havn't noticed I like to take a more sentimental value in my training, I'm not training just to kick ass. I was also taught that the first rule of fighting is: "Don't Fight". And honestly, I'm not the biggest person to join competition. I don't like sport fighting, that's why I'm not the biggest fan of boxing and BJJ. TOO many glorify it all in my school alone that if they found out I was training in it they would set up a cage in the gym and make me verse EVERYONE until I couldn't move, then some. I know I sound like a rabbling teenager, but I am.

    And @It Is Fake, I didn't mean to make it sound like ALL dojo's are like that. I actually set this thread for people if they think their Dojo, is a McDojo too. It's a shame when new people to MA's like me back then waste time and money on a McDojo.
  6. BKR is online now
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2011 12:00am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kodokan Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm not convinced you have really ever trained in anything, or really are serious about training.
  7. helmutlvx is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2011 12:29am


     Style: In transition

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Goju-ryu is not a "karate base".

    If you've been training since you were 6, I'd say you've had maybe 4 or 5 years of good training. How's your hojo undo?

    My advice: Leave the "sport fighting" nonsense at the door and train with people who have gotten in the ring and beaten each other senseless. That's where the real grit is.
  8. bobyclumsyninja is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/18/2011 1:00am

    supporting member
     Style: Ex-Tiger KF, ex-SanDa

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I agree. I don't think a focus on sport, or competition is a bad thing. Focus on winning tappy tappy touch rules, would be detrimental possibly, but getting people to the point, where they can survive some rounds in/on the ring/cage/matt, would, in my opinion, provided for a higher standard of cardio, and conditioning...as there are people on the other side...not just conceptually, but actually training to win also.

    Watching mma fighters, thinking, "hey, they're not going all out, that's not so good to take to the str33t" would be a mistake....in that, them thinking they might go for 3 or more rounds, gives fighters an incentive to conserve, over a relatively large span of time. That wouldn't be true for all but the rarest str33t situations.

    In a streetfight, said fighters would more often than not wreck non-fighters of any style/art, in devastating fashion as they can better sustain damage, and continue to function rationally. Not only that, but not having to go rounds, or heed rules, will only help a person who is already sporting a solid base of skills.

    I've had more success out of the gym, than in, in a martial sense...but this is due to the quality of martial artist that was kicking my ass in the gym, not in spite of it. Bad at the sport, can still translate to success in the str33t, if dealing with people who don't even know what it's like to get hit hard, and still have to function.
  9. Cold_Skin is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2011 2:15am


     Style: Okinawan Go Ju Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by helmutlvx View Post
    Goju-ryu is not a "karate base".

    If you've been training since you were 6, I'd say you've had maybe 4 or 5 years of good training. How's your hojo undo?

    My advice: Leave the "sport fighting" nonsense at the door and train with people who have gotten in the ring and beaten each other senseless. That's where the real grit is.


    The dojo was great when I first started. We would train Tuesdays and Thursdays, working Kumite and Kobudo and Kata equally in a month, and we were always encouraged to work as hard as we could. We trained hard, we strove for perfection all the time. I reached SichiKyu rank, and things started to go downhill. My father even threatened to take me out because she failed me the first time I took to the test, even though I did perfectly. She openly admitted it to my mother even, but then on. Then from then on after that we started sparring less and less and Kata and Kobudo began to run the class, of course we did Kihon everyday though. Then I had to take a small break due to school issues, and I came back once I had them straightened out, that only took about 2 months. When I returned we pretty much did Kata, everyday for an hour doing the same Kata for that entire time. I had the Katas memorized pretty well because of this though. But it became bad habit. We would do that for about 3-5 classes straight, then we'd do a Kobudo class for a half hour, then more kata. repeat the 3-5 classes of kata. Then we would spar. The back to the 3-5 days, then our Senpai would work throws and ground defence. Not to mention we have a Black Belt that barely remembers the forms, granted he has a disability, but if our Sensei is busy talking with guests she would have him run class. And now for my Ichkyu test, after that schedule for 6 months, my Sensei almost didn't test me because she thought I didn't know the kata all the way. We did form, Application and Terminology for that whole time pretty much, I had it memorised to the T. She did test me and I did pass. But dring teh summer wee hit some financial crap shoots adn I couldn't return. That was how it was the last time I was there, virtually no sparring whatsoever. I had to start sparring my friends outside of the dojo just to get to practice utilizing what I knew. Not to mention in Kumite(Art of Grappling), we were pretty much restricted to punch, kick, block. We couldn't use any throws or GRAPPLING techniques taught to us.
  10. captainbirdseye is online now

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2011 4:17am


     Style: JJJ/BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cold_Skin View Post
    Not to mention in Kumite(Art of Grappling), we were pretty much restricted to punch, kick, block. We couldn't use any throws or GRAPPLING techniques taught to us.
    Kumite doesn't mean art of grappling.
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