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  1. #51
    bobyclumsyninja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resonance10 View Post
    Not much to tell except I realized I didn't know anything about sparring. I am grateful I found out before I descended to deep into the rabbit hole of self delusion about teh de@dly ###g #u.
    This is my experience also, although for the relatively short time I did kun_ _u, I managed to climb/fall far down the hole.

    Resistance undid everything I thought I could do. They'd have us do hands, or hands and feet(shins), and I was thoroughly pwned by all but the greenest. Once I knew I sucked, I could get some real work done, and build a skill(less)set of sorts.

  2. #52
    Resonance10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobyclumsyninja View Post
    This is my experience also, although for the relatively short time I did kun_ _u, I managed to climb/fall far down the hole.
    .
    Yes, I think a lot of people that start to do the fu are already quite deep down the rabbit hole before their even at a class. I.m.o its the 'media' of kf that helps this happen, tho its not quite as awful now as it was back when I started. ( no tinternets, no UFC/MMA and minimal RSBD ).

    I'd been reading the mags for a while before starting training so had a lot of bull floating round the cranium already. Additionally once you join a school it's often a circle jerk til humiliation happens and even then it can be rationalized away..rules/ illegal techniques etc

    To be fair to my old school wasn't as bad as it could have been.
    The problem was : NO sparring til brown sash which could be 3 years depending on the person and how much time put in.

    When you did spar their was no safety gear, you went until contact and then depending where you had hit you would decrease the impact. ( you were expected to be able to take some punishment on the limbs and torso ). On occasion a crash helmet might be worn.

    At black sash you were supposed to go out and cross hands with other schools/styles. ( Often not in a polite fashion either I'm afraid ).

    There is video of this on youtube, can dig it up if interested? Also be interested in folks' opinions on it. If so let me know where to post it.

    #teaser# one such vid has some amusing footage of kungfu man 'Borat' style :)
    Last edited by Resonance10; 11/08/2011 1:21pm at . Reason: 'readability'

  3. #53
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    because it is simple.

  4. #54

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Great depth through simplicity.

  5. #55
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    Because boxing, in a street situation involves fast hand movement combined with stable feet which can move the whole body out of range and then counter attack. If you are blessed with extraordinary balance and feet fast enough to get through a boxers defences then I guess the kicking methods give more options. However for most mortals imho Western boxing gives the best odds in an unexpected street brawl. I have seen small British Army boxers devastate the hard men of the Parachute Regiment by fearless and confident handwork. Pitching one form of combat sport against another is pretty pointless. I like to box. I am a bad kicker. I am way happier balanced on two feet and with my guard up and protected. But you will not catch me bad mouthing any combat athlete. We go to what suits us. Boxing suits me. Any even basically competent combat athlete will devastate any chancer. And be disciplined enough not to go brawling with another athlete to prove some half baked point of machismo. Sparring which is integral to boxing is unbeatable for controlling fear or adrenaline. As to other systems, I don't know enough to do more than babble bullshit. My son went to a bad martial arts school, and I had to unteach him all kinds of nonsense, but that is bad teaching for you.

  6. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Resonance10 View Post
    At black sash you were supposed to go out and cross hands with other schools/styles. ( Often not in a polite fashion either I'm afraid ).

    There is video of this on youtube, can dig it up if interested? Also be interested in folks' opinions on it. If so let me know where to post it.

    #teaser# one such vid has some amusing footage of kungfu man 'Borat' style :)
    I'd be down with seeing that. Send it in a PM if you get the chance to find it. Thanks.

    My opinion of boxing and street fighting is rather simple since I have a limited understanding of boxing, but what I can say is that keeping your hands up and your head covered is one of the most key things about fighting, along with having a stance that you won't trip over. A lot of people that join my school with little experience sparring usually start with their hands at their chest (including myself at one point) so their head gets ding'd pretty quick. Good news is that they learn quick, too. :P

  7. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idlesurfer View Post
    Because boxing, in a street situation involves fast hand movement combined with stable feet which can move the whole body out of range and then counter attack. If you are blessed with extraordinary balance and feet fast enough to get through a boxers defences then I guess the kicking methods give more options. However for most mortals imho Western boxing gives the best odds in an unexpected street brawl. I have seen small British Army boxers devastate the hard men of the Parachute Regiment by fearless and confident handwork. Pitching one form of combat sport against another is pretty pointless. I like to box. I am a bad kicker. I am way happier balanced on two feet and with my guard up and protected. But you will not catch me bad mouthing any combat athlete. We go to what suits us. Boxing suits me. Any even basically competent combat athlete will devastate any chancer. And be disciplined enough not to go brawling with another athlete to prove some half baked point of machismo. Sparring which is integral to boxing is unbeatable for controlling fear or adrenaline. As to other systems, I don't know enough to do more than babble bullshit. My son went to a bad martial arts school, and I had to unteach him all kinds of nonsense, but that is bad teaching for you.
    Minor Point.

    In the past (pro-boxing) Billy Schwer beat an opponent (British Title LW defence) who was ex-PARA. Billy dismantled him. It was a highly skilled performance and featured on ITV. The opponent was wholly honourable and gave his best but he was just outclassed.

  8. #58

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    I would also like to mention the issue of the style of footwork and movement that was used by the traditional MAs in the clip:

    every time they were pressured by a forward motion, they would leap straight back six o'clock style.

    Yes, the first guy used a lot of circling type stuff and when he was in range let go with a few hard sparring type combinations that were so thoughtfully directed into the boxer's guard, but if there is one thing i have learned about the pugilism, it is to seriously reconsider the first reactionary response of "move back, move back, move back, move back", rather than "move back and to the side" or even "move forward and to the side".

    i think both of these MAs were pretty seriously outclassed by the boxers, but it kinda hurts me right in front kick target to see these guys retreat retreat retreat.

  9. #59

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    Boxers learn what it feels like to take a shot. They don't panic at initial contact.

    Go to an amateur MMA show in your local area and watch the people who think they are fighters who flinch from punches and turn their heads and body away from pressure.

    Then go watch videos of boxers. If you see a knockout between medium to high skill level boxers their eyes will often be wide open even at the moment of impact. In my opinion that mental toughness is what separates boxers. You don't develop it doing Kata or point sparring.

    My instructor has a quote at the bottom of rank certificates: "To be a great fighter you must learn how to hit and be hit."

  10. #60

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    Is effective because it have rules that allow it to be effective and people are paid to box.

    Eventually, in something as old as boxing, someone would notice that training in a certain way would bring more results than training in other way.

    The rules of a martial art, the time it exists, the amount of people practicing and the dedication of these people to winning is what determines the effectiveness of a martial art and boxing got all of these.

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