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  1. Devil is online now
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    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 1:33pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomicpoet View Post
    My point wasn't that Aldo and Jones aren't talented -- they are. They just don't seem to be the future face of MMA. Who is waiting in the wings to become the next Fedor or GSP? Nobody.

    Part of this may have to do with the UFC's penchant for promoting their brand over their fighters. It almost seems as though Dana wants to de-emphasize the UFC's biggest stars in favour of the next MEGA HUGE GREATEST BIGGEST EVENT IN UFC HISTORY!

    And you know what? That's a crying shame -- especially now that the constant claims to actually being "better" entertainment are getting a lot more questionable.
    You have no idea who will or will not become the next Fedor or GSP, or the next Tyson or Ali for that matter. Neither do I. Start saying things that are less retarded.

    If you think the UFC doesn't promote their biggest stars, you're losing your mind. Hell, if anything, they're OVER-hyped. Seriously, where do you get this **** from? Also, I think it's very easy for them to promote the individual events because the sport is fucking awesome. They can have a card with very few big name fighters and it can be amazing.

    Your comments are beginning to border on lunacy.
  2. Soldiermedic is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 1:34pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tranquil Suit View Post
    PrideFC was better. They had a better theme song. :)
    I miss Lenne Hardt
  3. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 1:43pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomicpoet View Post
    One of the biggest fights in boxing is happening in two weeks. Klitschko is fighting Haye.
    According to who? Marketing? The biggest boxing event to happen would have been Manny vs. Floyd.



    JCC Jr. is everything wrong with the boxing world. He's living off the fumes of daddy's name. His handlers are carefully managing his career, making sure he doesn't take any fights he can't win, marketing him as having a "lot of heart" -- when it's apparent to all he does not have an elite level of talent.
    Yes, because this has NEVER happened before. If this is what is wrong with boxing, it has been broken for a loooooooooooong time.


    The real middleweight champion is Sergio Martinez. Undisputed, he's the guy who sets the standard in the division. He's the one who completely owns it. JCC Jr. will never fight Martinez because if he did, he'd be exposed for the fraud that he is.
    Cut or get to his weight and prove he is a fraud. You want to call him a fight ducker fine. You want to say he picks his fights fine. Get some proof that his fights are fixed before calling a fighter a fraud.


    Two years ago, I wouldn't argue with you. But, as UFC's quality of product has gone down, and boxing's quality of product has gone up, this is no longer the case.
    Yes, and boxing has been in the dumps for so long there really is no comparison.
  4. atomicpoet is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 1:47pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by devil View Post
    You have no idea who will or will not become the next Fedor or GSP, or the next Tyson or Ali for that matter. Neither do I. Start saying things that are less retarded.
    I know Saul Alvarez is a breakout star, and will sell tickets for the next 10 years. I have no idea who in the UFC will do the same as far as prospects are concerned.

    Quote Originally Posted by devil View Post
    If you think the UFC doesn't promote their biggest stars, you're losing your mind.
    I never said UFC doesn't promote their biggest stars -- I said they promote their brand over their fighters. The UFC's weakness isn't that they don't promote their stars, it's that they don't promote their prospects so that they can become stars. Aldo and Jones don't sell tickets.

    Quote Originally Posted by devil View Post
    Also, I think it's very easy for them to promote the individual events because the sport is fucking awesome. They can have a card with very few big name fighters and it can be amazing.
    You must be watching totally different UFC events than me. Since December, what has been a single breakout card? Hell, even St-Pierre vs. Shields put me to sleep.
    Last edited by atomicpoet; 6/22/2011 1:56pm at .
  5. atomicpoet is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 1:50pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    According to who? Marketing? The biggest boxing event to happen would have been Manny vs. Floyd.
    No argument about the biggest possible boxing event to happen -- but the runner-up would be Klitschko vs. Haye. Tell me, is there any other possible match besides Pacquiao vs. Mayweather that is as big as this? This has been two years in the making.

    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    Cut or get to his weight and prove he is a fraud. You want to call him a fight ducker fine. You want to say he picks his fights fine. Get some proof that his fights are fixed before calling a fighter a fraud.
    I don't think he's a fixer, but he's definitely been proven to use performance enhancing drugs:

    http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/box...ory?id=4716150
    Last edited by atomicpoet; 6/22/2011 1:55pm at .
  6. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 2:12pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomicpoet View Post
    I know Saul Alvarez is a breakout star, and will sell tickets for the next 10 years. I have no idea who in the UFC will do the same as far as prospects are concerned.
    I would like your time machine so, I can see the lottery numbers for the next 10 years.

    I've spent years disagreeing with devil and in the last three months we have agreed on just about everything.


    I don't think he's a fixer, but he's definitely been proven to use performance enhancing drugs:

    http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/box...ory?id=4716150
    That's fine now you read this:

    http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2010...month-suspens/
    "Yes," answered Chavez, when asked if he was happy with the commission's decision. "I would love it, of course, as a fighter, if it was not even a one-month suspension. But I know it was difficult."

    Chavez failed the NSAC post-fight drug test Nov. 14, after testing positive for Furosemide, a diuretic that can be used by fighters to help cut weight or possibly mask steroid use.

    Chavez has never tested positive for steroids nor been suspended before in his professional career.
    So, no, he was caught using something that cut weight OR was a masking agent.
  7. Uglybugly is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 2:32pm


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    Another point. MMA striking.. how would measure up against striking from other organizations.. some guys in my gym said that ufc striking is not good compared to other organizations that only do striking..
  8. Vieux Normand is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 2:42pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomicpoet View Post
    The problem with UFC right now, is that the sport has hit a plateau -- that plateau is wrestling. Iím reminded of when Royce Gracie came in a shocked everyone he faced with jiu jitsu. No one knew how to fight it. Right now, a great deal of MMA fighters donít know how, or canít handle the wrestling ability of good wrestlers. These wrestlers are taking full advantage of this, and getting easy wins.
    Unless they're getting crane-kicked into retirement. If wrestling were the ultimate, all on it's own, we'd NEVER be seeing KOs from standup such as--well, one recent example--the one performed by Sam Stout.

    If MMA is on any kind of plateau, then it's been there before. Some approach to fighting comes along and seems totally dominant until other fighters figure it out and add it to the mix. That's one fundamental aspect of the ruleset that makes it interesting.
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 2:44pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uglybugly View Post
    Another point. MMA striking.. how would measure up against striking from other organizations.. some guys in my gym said that ufc striking is not good compared to other organizations that only do striking..
    We have huge threads on this point and after thousands of posts it comes down to the rule-set.
  10. atomicpoet is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/22/2011 2:58pm


     Style: Western Boxing, Tai Chi

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    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    I would like your time machine so, I can see the lottery numbers for the next 10 years.
    Would love to wager a bet on this. I really do think Saul Alvarez is the future face of boxing. The kid's got charisma and talent -- and he's got nowhere to go but up.


    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    So, no, he was caught using something that cut weight OR was a masking agent.
    We'll agree to disagree on this one, but I think the fact he was caught using a PED casts suspicion on his undefeated record. Granted, this wasn't as bad as Margarito putting plaster in his gloves -- but I feel the boxing world has given JCC Jr. advantages due to his name. Dismissing his suspension over PED is one of them.

    So yes, put this under the "reasons boxing continues to suck" pile.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vieux Normand View Post
    If MMA is on any kind of plateau, then it's been there before. Some approach to fighting comes along and seems totally dominant until other fighters figure it out and add it to the mix. That's one fundamental aspect of the ruleset that makes it interesting.
    I agree with you, and this is MMA's saving grace. I just hope UFC doesn't plateau for too long.
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