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  1. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/09/2011 7:36pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by BKR View Post
    I'm going to have to bail out of this for now, work just got busy. Google "Moyie Mud Bog" for a glimpse into my world. The boggers are all headed south and are all still rather intoxicated. Between the state police, the sheriff's deputies, and the local police,it's a LEO feeding frenzy.

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    Any more developed thoughts, now you have fewer hillbillies to lock up and only turkeys to shoot?
  2. Conde Koma is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/09/2011 9:38pm

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    do you have any suggestions for hitting this throw off of an over- or underhook? or do you recommend using this exclusively from the lapel/sleeve grip?
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  3. Just Guess is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/09/2011 9:54pm


     Style: ukemi & tapping out

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conde Koma View Post
    do you have any suggestions for hitting this throw off of an over- or underhook? or do you recommend using this exclusively from the lapel/sleeve grip?
    I don't think you can even do tai-otoshi that way. It's a te-waza, so the main action is supposed to take place through the hands, and I've always thought of it as requiring some space between tori and uke.
  4. Colin is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/09/2011 10:22pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Guess View Post
    I don't think you can even do tai-otoshi that way.
    Omega might disagree with that.

  5. Just Guess is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/09/2011 10:41pm


     Style: ukemi & tapping out

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    Quote Originally Posted by Colin View Post
    Omega might disagree with that.
    If he does than I'll completely accept that I'm wrong, but I don't see what his no-gi osoto-gari video is supposed to prove.
  6. Res Judicata is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/09/2011 10:53pm


     Style: Judo & BJJ

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    Instead of reaping, plant the leg and turn your hips. It'll turn into tai otoshi (or maybe uki goshi if you're too close). Not really feasible in a gi though.
  7. Just Guess is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/10/2011 12:17am


     Style: ukemi & tapping out

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    Quote Originally Posted by Res Judicata View Post
    Instead of reaping, plant the leg and turn your hips. It'll turn into tai otoshi (or maybe uki goshi if you're too close). Not really feasible in a gi though.
    Thing is that from an under or over hook I doubt it's possible to turn and not have so much body contact that its no longer tai-otoshi. I can she it working from head and arm control though.
  8. Colin is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/10/2011 1:01am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Guess View Post
    If he does than I'll completely accept that I'm wrong, but I don't see what his no-gi osoto-gari video is supposed to prove.
    It's supposed to prove that he can take a gi-judo throw and make it work with an underhook/overhook.

    You think he couldn't do the same thing to Tai-Otoshi?
  9. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/10/2011 4:27am

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    Its entirely possible to do Tai otoshi from non-standard grips, in fact when I was building resources for the thread I cam across some footage of Udo Quellmalz throwing Tai otoshi with a round the waist grip. I've thrown people with Tai otoshi in no gi grappling/ mma sparring with a head and arm wrap grip although not an over under.

    However, in order to get a good understanding of the technique it is vital to learn it from standard grips first as this will instill the fundamental skills that allow later adaptation and personalisation.
  10. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/10/2011 7:00am

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     Style: Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conde Koma View Post
    do you have any suggestions for hitting this throw off of an over- or underhook? or do you recommend using this exclusively from the lapel/sleeve grip?
    Addressed above whether it was possible to do the throw from alternative grips.

    As regards your specific question if you're ranked below brown belt/1st kyu or shodan I would recomend that you practice it from sleeve and lapel until you are proficient and are throwing people in randori. Then you can seek to adapt and personalise.

    If you're looking to use the throw outside of a Judo context i.e no gi grappling or MMA then I predict much disappointment unless you're already proficient with the throw from gi practice, as outlined above.

    One of the major issues with the close contact situation that arises from non standard gripping like over/under, russian grip, belt grips etc... is that it solves some of the problems of spacing and positioning whilst presenting its own challenges. If you're already proficient at dealing with spacing and positioning from the standar grip sleeve/lapel then it will be much easier for you to adapt and apply those fundamental skills to the close contact situation, if not then it will be harder.

    The advantage of the close contact grip situation is, of course, that it allows you to 'cheat' and against weaker, smaller or more incompetent opposition to overcome defences more easily.

    As regards specific advice, not really, although I guess generic advice such as breaking balance over the three smallest toes, as I mentioned in the OP and if in a no gi grappling/MMA context using the environment to your advantage i.e using the threat of being locked up against the cage as part of an action -reaction sequence to get uke to move forward presenting debana for the throw.

    On a general note I wanted to add these videos.

    This one from Bruce Kamastra, because its a really good and progressive example of how to drill Tai otoshi for moving uchikomi/ nagekomi



    This one by Kuldin Evgeny, because it shows another option for combinations into Tai otoshi and of resolving the kenka yotsu situation



    And this, because no matter how bad your Tai otoshi is, it'll never be as bad as this guy's

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