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  1. Petter is offline

    12th level logic wielder

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    1,964

    Posted On:
    4/29/2011 4:08pm


     Style: BJJ, judo, rapier

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by pokeroo View Post
    I think in RBSD such as Krav Maga they will usually say to just give your wallet over rather than risk your life, then show a gun disarm with the disclaimer "we only do this part if we believe we are going to get shot anyway". I'm sure some are a little more delusional than that though.
    Even with that disclaimer in front of disarming techniques, I wonder whether it does more harm or good. They may say that you should hand over your wallet, but they still teach you something that has you walking out thinking that you are better equipped to handle a gun to your face than you were before. This may or may not be true. Now, is this more likely to help, or to instil false confidence that gets you killed in a botched attempt to disarm somebody? **** if I know, but I wouldn’t place any large bets on the former.

    Also a big part of self defense and weapons training (like what swat would do) is role playing. I figure the chances of finding ones self in such a situation make it not worth doing, that and I don't think its normally good for one's mental health to role play getting attacked over and over again.
    Agreed, but also, for the reasons implicit in my above remarks, I think that gun disarms without realistic role playing to instil the habit of handing over a wallet, say, they may do more harm than good—so for average people I’d just steer clear of the whole thing. It may be different in high-risk professions and what not, but personally I have no interest in learning gun disarms.
    [ petterhaggholm.net | blog | essays ]
    [ self defence: general thoughts | bjj: “don’t go to the ground”? ]
    “The plural of anecdote is anecdotes, not data.”
  2. pokeroo is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Ontario
    Posts
    614

    Posted On:
    4/29/2011 4:15pm


     Style: mma

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Petter I agree with your comments 100%. I wouldn't train weapons disarms unless I were involved in law enforcement, which I'm not. Back when I did BJK I remember myself and another member tried role-playing self defense techniques with exactly what you said in mind, and it got boring for me pretty quickly. It wasn't something I would be willing to do often enough to be effective in anyway.

    In case anyone thinks I'm flip flopping, my initial comment was only because someone said they think this incident disproves RBSD (or something like that), which I disagreed with.
  3. Boneless is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    152

    Posted On:
    4/29/2011 6:39pm


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Sir i salute you!
    brave guy didn't deserve it.

    tragic
  4. Gustard is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Moving
    Posts
    196

    Posted On:
    4/29/2011 7:46pm


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Petter View Post
    Even with that disclaimer in front of disarming techniques, I wonder whether it does more harm or good. They may say that you should hand over your wallet, but they still teach you something that has you walking out thinking that you are better equipped to handle a gun to your face than you were before. This may or may not be true. Now, is this more likely to help, or to instil false confidence that gets you killed in a botched attempt to disarm somebody? **** if I know, but I wouldn’t place any large bets on the former.


    Agreed, but also, for the reasons implicit in my above remarks, I think that gun disarms without realistic role playing to instil the habit of handing over a wallet, say, they may do more harm than good—so for average people I’d just steer clear of the whole thing. It may be different in high-risk professions and what not, but personally I have no interest in learning gun disarms.
    anything that gives you falso confidence is bad. Trying to disarm somebody is a LAST resort when someobody is going to get hurt no matter what you do - when running away, giving away your wallet , begging for mercy , crying, pleading have all failed. Then knowing some sort of disarming technique might just come in useful.
    I met someone who worked with the top knifie disarm guy in the American military in Thailand - he was working with Burmese guerillas . He told me that the only two times this top military guy had been in a real situation where he had to disarm someone he had been stabbed both times - he disarmed them but he still got stabbbed - and thats the best in the world...
  5. hungryjoe is online now
    hungryjoe's Avatar

    Light Heavyweight

    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    3,405

    Posted On:
    4/30/2011 9:20am

    supporting member
     Style: judo hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There were about 150 people in the banquet hall when two men burst in, firing several times. Nedd scuffled with one of the intruders, and was shot. He later succumbed to his wounds, after being transported to the hospital.
    Who stands a chance against two armed men?

    Another armed man/woman.

    RIP Nedd.
  6. PizDoff is offline

    .

    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    18,598

    Posted On:
    5/01/2011 1:46pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Check out his Facebook memorial page here:

    https://www.facebook.com/ripkearn
    Surfing Facebook at work? Spread the good word by adding us on Facebook today! https://www.facebook.com/Bullshido
  7. Gosai is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    437

    Posted On:
    5/03/2011 7:19pm


     Style: Ju d'oh!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This is why I like the fantasy world of comic books more than the real world.
    In a comic book, Kearn would have not only saved the money and survived but developed a taste for the action donned a strange costume and fought crime as a hobby.
  8. kenburke is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Posts
    21

    Posted On:
    5/15/2011 7:18pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lock them up for life.
  9. PizDoff is offline

    .

    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    18,598

    Posted On:
    7/11/2011 10:57am

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Ontario area people, Toronto as well!

    MMA fighter Kearn Nedd was killed trying to stop a robbery. Support the Charity Martial Arts Seminar here
    https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=214968908528333
    Surfing Facebook at work? Spread the good word by adding us on Facebook today! https://www.facebook.com/Bullshido
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