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  1. #11
    Kintanon's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    OHHH... So you're mostly talking about styles that are already fairly shitty just shitting themselves up further in random ways.

    Or you could be talking about the natural proliferation of techinques in different directions. My instructor doesn't use the same **** that his instructor used because his style and body type are a little different. He tends to to teach the stuff HE uses with occasional forays into other stuff. It's not that he's refusing to teach us ****, it's that the class naturally trends in that direction. As a consequence he has been shown techniques that he may never show us simply because he hardly ever uses them. Not because they are SEKRET TEKNIKS!

    By the same token various other instructors all tend to teach mostly their own game and style. Some gyms are almost without leglocks, some are light on takedowns, others trend in various other directions. That's neither watering down, nor some conspiracy to keep knowledge away from people it's just the simple fact that it's HARD to transfer a lifetime of knowledge to people in less than a lifetime.

    What is important is that the techniques you do retain are high percentage techniques that work under pressure and the you practice under pressure. If you do that then it doesn't matter whether you got taught the 32nd hidden variation to leopard hugs the snake. The **** you DO know works.

  2. #12

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I must not be as clear as I think I am being. Sorry if this isn't coming out correctly.

    I don't disagree with anything you just said. Of course you will use the techniques that work best for you, and naturally, you would tend to teach that which you know works. That is NOT what I am referring to.

    There are people walking around with advanced rank who don't know half of the art. They are not aware that they do not know it. The techniques are not 'sekrit' at all, but they were not taught them.

    I do know that when I spar with them, and use a pin/lock or takedown, they give me a stern look and say 'don't do that, it's not Wado'. To the point where they don't teach breakfalling because 'it's not Wado.' Makes sweeping dangerous.

    And it is Wado. Is that more clear?
    Quote Originally Posted by pauli
    i was once told that "do" means wrecking people's **** for your own philosophical betterment.

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin_peebles
    I could be mistaking dumbness for delusion. I'll have to go dig out my DSM IV. It's great to have stumbled upon this site. The rich fauna and flora of mental dysfunction that exists in the martial arts is amazing. It's like the Galapagos.

  3. #13
    Kintanon's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Why do you get to define Wado?

    Who defines Wado? Where is the technique library for Wado codified? If a group of high ranking Wado people get together and make a list and say, "This! This is Wado!" and everyone in their schools follows their rules, then they have a Wado federation and that IS Wado for them and if the people from your side don't bother teaching your **** to everyone then after a few generations your **** is GONE and Wado is what that federation says it is.

    That is not necessarily watering down either. It's the evolution of the art.

    What I want to know is WHY you think someone would deliberately withhold techniques from their students?

  4. #14
    Styygens's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oh boy... I haven't got time to read all this now, but... SUBSCRIBE!

  5. #15
    Ignorami's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I did booj for 18 months. By my maths that makes me 6 times more qualified than the OP to defend ninjutsu.

    I shan't though.

    Styggens, As the respected voice of ninjing here, I'd love to know if you started with a thread like this, then managed to earn respect later, or if you were wise in your early days here.

    I nearly did it with an 'aikido is misunderstood' thread when I first joined. I even got as far as typing it up. I and my arsehole are pleased I held it in.
    Last edited by Ignorami; 3/14/2011 5:45pm at . Reason: I can't work my iPad


    When life gives you lemons... BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD!!

    "what's the best thing about aikido then?"
    "To be defeated by your enemies, to be driven by them from the field of battle, and to hear the lamentations of your women." ermghoti

  6. #16
    TaeBo_Master's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt and give him an intelligent response. I'll grant you that it's entirely possible for a person to train in some form of Bujinkan and become a badass. But 99.9% of people won't. That same person would become a badass training karate, TKD, Judo, or just doing pushups. It's hard to justify recommending a style on the slim slim chance you can become that diamond in the rough. Said badass would be far more badass in a MT school, BJJ, MMA, etc.

    Also, with all your talk of history, keep in mind that the old school ninjas were trained first and foremost in techniques of stealth, camoflauge, weapons, and some hand-to-hand but certainly not a primary focus. Their skillset (if we are to assume the history to be true) was broad, not deep. In one on one combat, a Samurai would have their head. We do have that equivalent today, but you won't find it in a Bujinkan school. We call them Special Forces.

    Quote Originally Posted by ninpolives
    Little kids call names and make things up...respectable adults usually should not.
    This almost always means "please please please don't say mean things to me!"
    Click To Get My Free Training Newsletter... Do It NOW!


    "You all just got fucking owned.";
    "TaeBo_Master and GajusCaesar just scored 10,000,000 points on all you pawns."

    - The Wastrel

  7. #17

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ninpolives View Post
    I have noticed a lot of the people who practice the "new" way are fat, slow, and do not move like fighters or ninja.
    Quote Originally Posted by Permalost View Post
    Or what you think a ninja moves like.
    ninpolives, would you be so kind to make a you-tube-vid about how fighters and ninja move for real, please. I am very curious and would like to learn from your immense insight.

    thank you in advance.

  8. #18
    TaeBo_Master's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I second the video/pic evidence request. Badassery usually leaves a trace.
    Click To Get My Free Training Newsletter... Do It NOW!


    "You all just got fucking owned.";
    "TaeBo_Master and GajusCaesar just scored 10,000,000 points on all you pawns."

    - The Wastrel

  9. #19
    Conde Koma's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    subscribed.
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    Watching violence on film, violently.
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  10. #20

    Join Date
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Your post is confusing as:



    "Before this gets brought up, let me go ahead and say that debates regarding the historical legitimacy of Ninjutsu styles are pointless."

    VS

    "At one time, there were over 100 ryu of Ninjutsu known to exist in Japan. That much is fact. For all we know, they might all have survived in secret to this day, but we have no way to know."

    WTF?

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