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  1. Permalost is online now
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    pro nonsense self defense

    Join Date
    Nov 2012
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    San Diego
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    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 5:39pm

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kostic View Post
    Also I just dislike ground fighting is because it looks like its just two dudes trying to hump each other into submission.
    Most martial arts look like something silly. Karate kinda looks like you're trying to swat a fly in your pajamas. Escrima looks like you're trying to theatrically start a fire with two sticks. Kendo looks like two insects mating. Just accept that you're gonna be doing something silly looking.

    I'd prefer to learn a few throws and just rely on strking to avoid being taken to the ground.
    That's how I felt when I did kung fu. I got downright molested in my first mixed striking/grappling tournament.


    idk if I'm on the right path but if you can drop somebody with an elbow does it matter how goood they are at grappling?
    A lot of the top level elbow-droppers are grapplers. They can get into better positions to do it well.
  2. aiyer is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 6:02pm


     Style: Muay Thai, Savate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kostic View Post
    Id prefer to learn a few throws and just rely on strking to avoid being taken to the ground. idk if I'm on the right path but if you can drop somebody with an elbow does it matter how goood they are at grappling?
    That was what I thought as well, that was basically what everyone thought pre UFC 1. It didn't work out for me and it didn't work out for those in the first UFC matches. It's quite simple really: the only way to avoid being taken to the ground/getting up again is to train groundfighting.
  3. cejames is offline

    Featherweight

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Berkeley California
    Posts
    15

    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 6:11pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Isshin Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kostic View Post
    ... and the vertical punch seems good for the area it is suppose to target but there are some parts that worry me. I would like to here what people think of it. Like strengths and weaknesses.
    I have a new theory about the fist and its formation in regard to martial systems with an emphasis on Isshinryu vertical fist.

    A highly experienced person is thought to have said at a seminar that originally the Okinawan Te or Toudi system used the vertical fist, thumb on top, vertical strike methods BUT changed them or watered them down for reasons yet still unknown.

    Here is where I add in my theory. Yes, it was the more effective version long, long ago. The Okinawan Masters early 1900's wanted to incorporate karate into the school systems. They watered down the kata for this reason and may have also adjusted the fist formation to lessen its effectiveness for safety reasons and teaching young adults in the school system.

    Tatsuo Sensei merely reinvented and reintroduced the original fist/formation/use into the Isshinryu system. In other words it was not really his innovative way in creating this system but an redux of old back into a new.

    Regardless of the accuracy or truth or factual validation this is merely a theory.

    Another one as to the thumb. It has also been posed that depending on the technique, its particular application, the person using, etc. the thumb can be set at different places to either enhance or detract from the goal of said technique.

    Another theory and no real basis to prove it one way or the other BUT it does make you think.

    As to some parts that worry you, remember just because something is awkward or does not work like you "think" it should does not mean it don't work. Things like this are subjective and dependent on the person, the instructor, the system, and its application which is diverse as to the system and the technique and the bunkai - they all matter and all have different specifications, etc.

    Charles J.
  4. Mario915 is offline

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    39

    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 6:23pm


     Style: HKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kostic View Post
    Yeah they never said anything about not sparing because it was to deadly to use any of our techniques. Also I just dislike ground fighting is because it looks like its just two dudes trying to hump eachother into submission. Id prefer to learn a few throws and just rely on strking to avoid being taken to the ground. idk if I'm on the right path but if you can drop somebody with an elbow does it matter how goood they are at grappling?
    I dabble with the BJJ for one reason, so I dont get the **** pounded out of me when fighting someone with BJJ experience. While others on this site call me watered down, I try to use it when training HKD. Be careful your opinions dont result in your losing when it counts.
  5. Lindz is online now

    Senior Member

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    Oct 2008
    Location
    Burnaby B.C.
    Posts
    3,007

    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 6:56pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by aiyer View Post
    That was what I thought as well, that was basically what everyone thought pre UFC 1. It didn't work out for me and it didn't work out for those in the first UFC matches. It's quite simple really: the only way to avoid being taken to the ground/getting up again is to train groundfighting.
    oh so close

    train ground grappling to get up or win on the ground
    train standup grappling to stay on your feet

    see these guys?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33LJQWo1xao

    no ground game but i bet you cant put them on their ass
  6. Jeff Kostic is offline

    Featherweight

    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Philadelphia
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    20

    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 10:23pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Isshinryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Sorry for slow reply. I was at work. No that's not it. Its just a small group branched off from the psu. I am going to a free trial at a bjj place. Ill see how it goes. I think actually getting beaten by them would make it more clear. I doubt they would like me asking to fight with them to see how good there stuff is..
  7. Jeff Kostic is offline

    Featherweight

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    Philadelphia
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    Posted On:
    3/02/2011 11:15pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Isshinryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Im also realizing that issginryu is greater than the some of its basics are made mainly to train you. So is alot of stuff in many karate styles. I have two questions. What makes muai thai such a good system and with all of the kneeing and elbows in Mom why do they where the gloves.
  8. helmutlvx is offline

    Registered Member

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    Apr 2010
    Location
    West Virginia
    Posts
    1,952

    Posted On:
    3/03/2011 12:17pm


     Style: In transition

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kostic View Post
    Im also realizing that issginryu is greater than the some of its basics are made mainly to train you. So is alot of stuff in many karate styles. I have two questions. What makes muai thai such a good system and with all of the kneeing and elbows in Mom why do they where the gloves.
    I think that it's great you're giving BJJ a try and seeing what it feels like. One's own senses are much better gauges of effectiveness than say, YouTube. In that same vein, I think you should also try some light sparring with a Muay Thai fighter to feel what a different range of combat the clinch is.
  9. Jeff Kostic is offline

    Featherweight

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    Philadelphia
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    Posted On:
    3/03/2011 12:25pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Isshinryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah I have a couple buddies im going to spar with.wrestling muai thai and bjj.I told them to do the best the can if I get beat up ill be happy. If I win ill be satisfied either way ill have a better understanding.
  10. bcarollo is offline

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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1

    Posted On:
    3/24/2011 5:40pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Isshin-Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hi New guy here. Been studying Isshinryu 13 years. My Sensei always incorporated takedown defenses, judo throws and Chin-Na to round out our training which was invaluable. He used to say you can learn something useful from every style. Isshinryu can be extremely effective against BJJ if you take the time to learn how to stuff BJJ takedowns WHILE AT THE SAME TIME incorporating issinryu striking techniques. I roll with BJJ guys all the time but when it comes to standing full contact kumite, the striking during takedown defense neutralizes the attacker. It's all about practice and creativity as every fight is unique as is every fighter.
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