Self appointed BJJ Blackbelt?

[MartialArtsNH]

Wow, great points and well put. You successfully summed up how I feel about Martial Arts in general. People are way too caught up in ego. "White Belt For Life!!!"

[MartialArtsNH]

If the your guy in Cali seems good and you like him and can learn from him why wouldn't you train with him? I love boxing too and train with anyone that I like to train with and can learn from and vice versa. None of those boxers or instructors have black belts or have won the heavyweight belt :)

[It is Fake]

Seriously? Is that you? Glass Houses? I have certificates for my lineage claims. I have certificates for my Educational claims. I have papers for my writing claims. Let's not build strawmen arguments. If you fudge your background glass houses do not come into play.

[Sam Browning]

If the your guy in Cali seems good and you like him and can learn from him why wouldn't you train with him? I love boxing too and train with anyone that I like to train with and can learn from and vice versa. None of those boxers or instructors have black belts or have won the heavyweight belt :)

The issue is not whether you should train with people who do not have such belts. The issue is whether a Martial Artist should self promote himself to black belt in BJJ and then start promoting others.

Unless he tells everyone who comes to his studio "hey, I promoted myself to Black Belt BEFORE they paid him money, or signed a contract" his conduct is deceptive and means that these students will not find others to study with who earned their ranks from people who were qualified to award such Black Belts.

[FinalLegion]

I also wondered this about 3 years ago when I first metScott. I found that his training wasamazing and I wanted to understand his lineage. I didn’t know him very well at that point and I heard that he trained atthe Gracie Academy so I emailed them directly. Ryron was kind enough to respond to me directly and let me know that hehad been promoted to Brown Belt (maybe 2nd degree?) at the Academyand spoke very fond of him as a person and instructor. I felt good about this communication andsigned up to train with him month to month after that. He has always been open and honest in myexperience and doesn’t hide the fact that he put on his Black belt when the timewas right. He’s a kind person, full oflove, respect and knowledge and does an amazing job with his students. I’ve known many of his students for years nowand they’ve won tournaments (Male and Female and Scott included if that evenmatters…some of the toughest people and best instructors I know don’t evenparticipate in tournaments) and are a tight group of well-respected citizensfrom all walks of life in NH. They areall legit! I would highly recommendScott and his program. I’ve also seenScott roll with other Black Belts and have been to Ryron seminars and seenother students that come from that lineage. They’ve all been amazing.

I’d also like to address some of the sarcastic or harshcomments that reference making jokes about other people. We all live in glass houses don’t we? I’vehad the opportunity to train with many instructors and schools here in NH &MA and have sat in to observe even more. I’m happy to say that there are many fine instructors and schools in thearea, but there are also others that are probably the same commenting on thischain with their own flaws that turn my stomach. I’ve experienced shady instructors that seemmore like sleaze ball sales people (vs. real Martial Artists) that anyone withany real world professional experience will see right through, pyramid scheme typeprogram behavior, lower ranking belts teaching most of the classes, demandsthat you purchase their house gi’s, overcharging, crazy contracts at some ofthe large chains….I’ve seen them take big $ from students all kinds of seminarsfrom different BJJ or MMA personalities….(I’ve paid for some of them myselfunfortunately! They didn’t compare towhat Ryron and Scott put on) you name it’s going on but there’s no need to dragpeople through the mud here.

The bottom line is that people should train with whoeverhelps them get better and works with them to meet their goals. My experience with Scott Lewis has been thathe would give the shirt off of his back for his students and considers themfamily. Anyone training with him orunder him should be proud to be associated with him. He’s a great BJJ Instructor.

No one here is questioning how likable or personable Scott is. They are questioning whether or not his Black Belt in BJJ is legit or is it self-appointed, as the evidence, so far, seems to indicate. If Scott decided for himself that he had been training long enough and was good enough to have a Black Belt...and then simply awarded one to himself then that undercuts the very principle and ideal of being a student. If everyone was left to their own devices in this respect, then everyone would be a Black Belt whenever they personally felt they deserved it. If it's left in the hands of the students, what's the point of belt tests at all?

If Scott did promote himself to Black Belt, he owes it to every student he teaches to let them in on that truth. We all know that students tend to gravitate towards instructors that have high ranks; I mean, if we're confronted with two potential teachers in BJJ, one with a Purple Belt, the other with a Black Belt, who do you think the student will choose?

[jnp]

I've taken the liberty of breaking up your unreadable wall of text into more easily digestible pieces. I also got rid of your New Calibri font. Despite this, your post still gives me mental heartburn.

I also wondered this about 3 years ago when I first metScott. I found that his training wasamazing and I wanted to understand his lineage.

Hi Scott.

I didn’t know him very well at that point and I heard that he trained atthe Gracie Academy so I emailed them directly. Ryron was kind enough to respond to me directly and let me know that hehad been promoted to Brown Belt (maybe 2nd degree?) at the Academyand spoke very fond of him as a person and instructor.

There is no such thing as a second degree brown belt in BJJ. The only rank that has the term "degree" attached to it is black belt.

I’d also like to address some of the sarcastic or harshcomments that reference making jokes about other people. We all live in glass houses don’t we? I’vehad the opportunity to train with many instructors and schools here in NH &MA and have sat in to observe even more. I’m happy to say that there are many fine instructors and schools in thearea, but there are also others that are probably the same commenting on thischain with their own flaws that turn my stomach.

I’ve experienced shady instructors that seemmore like sleaze ball sales people (vs. real Martial Artists) that anyone withany real world professional experience will see right through, pyramid scheme typeprogram behavior, lower ranking belts teaching most of the classes, demandsthat you purchase their house gi’s, overcharging, crazy contracts at some ofthe large chains….I’ve seen them take big $ from students all kinds of seminarsfrom different BJJ or MMA personalities….(I’ve paid for some of them myselfunfortunately! They didn’t compare towhat Ryron and Scott put on) you name it’s going on but there’s no need to dragpeople through the mud here.

The bottom line is that people should train with whoeverhelps them get better and works with them to meet their goals. My experience with Scott Lewis has been thathe would give the shirt off of his back for his students and considers themfamily. Anyone training with him orunder him should be proud to be associated with him. He’s a great BJJ Instructor.

What you typed there? My compost has more value than it does. You are clearly an apologist for Mr. Lewis (look it up before you reply or you'll look even more foolish).

It's also completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand. We are discussing whether Mr. Lewis has the right to represent himself as a black belt in BJJ.

I've spent ten years sweating and bleeding on the mat, putting in the hard work to get to the rank of brown belt. I spent five years as a purple belt trying to figure out what I needed to do to get to brown. During this period I NEVER even thought of promoting myself. Nor have countless other practitioners of the art who have struggled to progress. To do so would dishonor our commitment to BJJ.

If Mr. Lewis promoted himself to the rank of black belt, he has severely dishonored both our arts. That is my opinion.

[It is Fake]

People are way too caught up in ego. "White Belt For Life!!!"

Then why did he self promote to Black Belt? That means you are sitting in that "glass house" with everyone else while sipping on a cool glass of hypocrisy.

[freakzilla]

I guess that settles the issue. If MartialArtsNH is one of his students and told him he did (and doesn't hide the fact) put on the Black Belt when he thought he was ready. By that statement he is a "self appointed" Black Belt.

I know during my training I felt I was ready on numerous occasions but obviously I wasn't because I didn't get promoted. I would never self promote myself.

What does that mean for the Black Belt under him? I am not sure how he walks around telling everyone he is a Black Belt. He is not a Black Belt he just wears one.

[money]

Ryron ... let me know that he had been promoted to Brown Belt (maybe 2nd degree?) at the Academy

He ... doesn’t hide the fact that he put on his Black belt when the time was right.

For the tl;dr crowd, I cut out everything except what is actually applicable to the conversation. The question was does he have a legitimate black belt in BJJ. The answer appears to be no.

[Uncle Skippy]

I was in contact with Mr Lewis last week.

Here is the content of our e-mail exchange. My focus was to be courteous to try to let Mr Lewis present his side of the story and provide as much information as he could. When trying to discover information, far too many people shut down early in the conversation because of accusations. I wanted to make sure that Mr Lewis had the opportunity to provide as much information as he could without feeling 'accused' of anything.

Mr Lewis,

I'm writing because there is a thread about you on Bullshido:

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=104014

Instead of making assumptions and repeating word-of-mouth, I decided to write you directly to ask about your BJJ training.

Just to put this thread to rest, can you let me know who gave you your BJJ Black Belt?

I'm not at all looking to try to twist words or "dig into" you. That's not who I am or how I work. I just want to give you a voice in the thread to help verify your training so people can move on to other things. I won't quote you out of context, nor will I do anything other than repeat exactly what you tell me. I absolutely hate gossip and will never feed into that; it goes against the spirit of martial arts.

Thank you for your time and I hope to hear from you.

If I don't hear from you, I wish you good training.

Regarding the thread :
I am 43 years old and a Ronin Black Belt...... any one who asks i tell them this.
Ryron is my teacher and friend but i am not currently ranked under him.
i have never claimed linage.
naga 2009 expert gi 1st my age bracket
naga 2010 expert gi 1st age bracket younger than my age mat Santos vrs Scott lewis you tube
2011 i decided to compete agaist Bruno bastos and pinto (2 age groups down from me
there were many black belts that cowered at those matches and dropped out.

2011 superfight against dan simmler .....16 years younger than me..
my door is always open and i dont sit behind a desk..
i teach every jiu jitsu class on the schedule i roll with any one who walks tru the door...
as well as all of my students every day.
i have no contracts at my school.
i encourage any one coming to my school to try the other schools in the area to compare programs before they start training.
my students often travel and always fair well when visiting other jiu jitsu schools.
i encourage them to visit the best schools they can find.
my students win tournaments..
look on my web sight...
a belt only covers 2 inches of your ass...belt or no belt i will still be right here doing what im doing training with Ryron and watch my students enjoy jiu jitsu and win medals...against some of those teams that think im a joke..
scott lewis

Mr Lewis,

Thank you for your reply. As I promised, I will never quote you out of context and I am in no way "out to get you". I realize that you have no reason to trust me. My only goal is to provide information. That's it.

The only question I have is what is a Ronin Black Belt? Is that a school? Or is it a reference to a masterless Samurai from feudal Japan?

As you already know (and are probably tired of hearing), people have issues with you possibly granting yourself a black belt. I'm not going to straight-up ask you that because I don't think that would be productive. Rather, I was hoping if you could let me know what formal training you've had. By that, I mean which schools you've trained at over the years, and in particular the ones in which you've spent the most time. The current perception is that you have shown up to various seminars with different belts each time, but nobody knows if/where you've been training. I'm hoping to quell that perception and give you a voice to state your training history.

It is obvious that you've been training a long time and there is no doubt in my mind that you have skill. No doubt. Your students do well, and you put yourself out there and compete on a regular basis (which is not something that a 'fake' would do). I can't emphasize how much your competition experience speaks positively towards your skills.

Has there been any talk between you and Ryron about him ranking you? (I hope this question isn't overstepping any bounds).

Thank you again for your time. It is greatly appreciated.

any other questions call the academy and talk to Ryron Gracie he is on his honey moon right now but will be back soon.
Ryron used me on his last shoot for bjj weekly.
cheers..

At this point, I don't know if there is much more that he's willing to discuss. It is obvious his last e-mail was designed to shut down the conversation.

There are a couple of things I wanted to note about the conversation:

- "Ronin Black Belt": I asked if this was a rank through an existing school or a reference to a masterless Samurai. He didn't address that in his reply (nor anything else). My gut feeling is that it is an acknowledgment that he did promote himself.

- Ryron has not ranked Mr Lewis: The mention of such from MartialArtsNH is without merit since this comes directly from Mr Lewis himself. In fact, Mr Lewis has never claimed any lineage under any instructor.

- Numerous statements to minimize the meaning of belts: We've seen "a belt only holds up your pants" and similar references before, along with "my students compete and do well elsewhere". If the belt doesn't mean that much, then why claim any rank at all? Why (based on my gut feeling) did he promote himself to any belt if it is all about results? We all pretty much know the answer to this, but the hypocrisy is rather blatant.

Why would any person want to talk to Ryron to get information about Mr Lewis? Why would Mr Lewis put that burden on Ryron to defend him?

I'm sure that Mr Lewis has skill. I'm sure that Ryron will support Mr Lewis' skill level, but everybody here knows that it is NOT about his skill level, his personality, or his performance.

It is about making unsubstantiated claims and the lack of respect for the traditions of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu (belting himself).