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  1. Res Judicata is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/23/2011 9:15pm


     Style: Judo & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Okuri ashi barai is one of the throws that made me think: hmm, there's something to this Judo thing. My second day in judo, a godan threw me with this (not that I knew what it was). My feet were pointing at the ceiling as I fell.

    Thanks for the videos. This isn't a throw we practice much and I'd never seen that form. Worth practicing!
  2. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/24/2011 7:00am

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     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Res Judicata View Post
    Thanks for the videos. This isn't a throw we practice much and I'd never seen that form. Worth practicing!
    Its not that common a throw but it is a beauty. Try it both ways the Okano and kata form see which one suits you best. For both of them you will need a good uke though.
  3. dustymars is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/24/2011 8:52am


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by BKR View Post
    Dusty, thanks for sharing your memories and experience with us younger guys. You got to lay hands on some legends of Judo for sure,and that experience is priceless.

    I almost exclusively do De Ashi Barai and Okuri Ashi Barai when Uke is moving backwards or in a circle now. Most guys always pull away, and can be caught action-reaction as they do so with either throw, depending on the angle.

    As you pointed out, the back and forth method of training is mostly what I use, either moving sideways,circle, or back and forth at different angles. Lots of ashi sabaki/tai sabaki tandoku renshuu as another poster mentioned as well.



    Ben
    Yes, catching uke in a backward stepping or sliding motion is good for entry with Okuri ashi. Uke is caught off guard mentally because they never expect that type of throw with that movement. I used to love it when uke stepped to his rear then apply hane goshi, or harai tsurikomi ashi, and especially Okuri ashi barai – they never expect such a thing.

    Some of our sensei of old would indicate, at times even tell us how to do something and then do it the exact opposite way. Then he would stand there watching for someone to react and ask why he did the technique another way. Most people expect Okuri ashi if they slide or stepped sideways, and when you hit them in a short circular manner their highly charged kiai was a sign they were caught completely off guard.

    Remember, legends were beginners at some point in time. :)
  4. BKR is offline
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2011 2:47am

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by dustymars View Post
    Yes, catching uke in a backward stepping or sliding motion is good for entry with Okuri ashi. Uke is caught off guard mentally because they never expect that type of throw with that movement. I used to love it when uke stepped to his rear then apply hane goshi, or harai tsurikomi ashi, and especially Okuri ashi barai – they never expect such a thing.

    Some of our sensei of old would indicate, at times even tell us how to do something and then do it the exact opposite way. Then he would stand there watching for someone to react and ask why he did the technique another way. Most people expect Okuri ashi if they slide or stepped sideways, and when you hit them in a short circular manner their highly charged kiai was a sign they were caught completely off guard.

    Remember, legends were beginners at some point in time. :)
    LOL, some of us never get much past beginner stage, let alone legend status!

    Ben
  5. DarkPhoenix is offline
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    I feel like you eyeballin' me, dawg!

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2011 3:54pm

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     Style: Judo, JJJ, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    We have been taught how to do it the way it is demonstrated in the second video. Seeing it performed on the way Okano does is an intriguing way of doing it. I never would have thought to attempt it that way. I will have to study this video further and work on it with my coach and the other brown belts.

    Judoka, Ben and Dusty never fail to impress upon me the vastness of their judo knowledge.

    Chin ups for all.
    Quote Originally Posted by Holy Moment View Post
    BJJ JOE: I'm going to make hate to you. Right here, right now.
    ... Ohhhhhhhh, I'm going to make hate to you so hard that your kinfolk back in Africa will feel it.l
    Quote Originally Posted by Archer
    Karate is the Dane Cook of martial arts
  6. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/26/2011 7:26am

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     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you think I have a vast knowledge of Judo you're going to **** yourself when you meet someone who actually does have a vast knowledge of Judo!
  7. DarkPhoenix is offline
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    I feel like you eyeballin' me, dawg!

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    Posted On:
    1/26/2011 7:39am

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, JJJ, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by judoka_uk View Post
    If you think I have a vast knowledge of Judo you're going to **** yourself when you meet someone who actually does have a vast knowledge of Judo!

    I always felt my coach did and still does. You are just bringing it to a much larger audience than he can. :-)
    Quote Originally Posted by Holy Moment View Post
    BJJ JOE: I'm going to make hate to you. Right here, right now.
    ... Ohhhhhhhh, I'm going to make hate to you so hard that your kinfolk back in Africa will feel it.l
    Quote Originally Posted by Archer
    Karate is the Dane Cook of martial arts
  8. Coach Josh is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/26/2011 9:48am

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Gladiators Academy Lafayette, LA Style: Judo, MMA, White Trash JJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    One point on the teaching methodology. First thing is people need to learn to move most of the time is spent on them just trying to coordinate their footwork. Instead of natural movement they try to move in a manner that will not allow them to get thrown especially beginners. I spend a lot of time just getting guys footwork correct because most people can not move in an athletic manner.

    This is one reason for the side stepping method. After awhile I was taught it like Okano Sensei is demonstrating but only after some proficiency in Judo was developed.

    Secondly look at a class that Okano Sensei is instructing and tell me how many white belts are in that class.
    Judo is only gentle for the guy on top.
  9. Res Judicata is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/26/2011 11:17am


     Style: Judo & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    FWIW, as an adult beginner, footsweeps have been some of the hardest things to learn. People who learned Judo as a kid -- even for a short time -- seem to do much better with them. The coordination involved, as Josh suggests, is a very high barrier. Add to that the necessary timing and awareness of the opportunities -- feeling -- and you have recipe for frustration. Uchi mata is a piece of cake compared to okuri ashi barai.

    There is no way I could have done the Okano-style as a true beginner. The traditional method seems to be a good way of developing timing and feeling -- that moment when uke is virtually weightless.
  10. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/26/2011 11:37am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach Josh View Post
    One point on the teaching methodology. First thing is people need to learn to move most of the time is spent on them just trying to coordinate their footwork. Instead of natural movement they try to move in a manner that will not allow them to get thrown especially beginners. I spend a lot of time just getting guys footwork correct because most people can not move in an athletic manner.
    This is very true. I always feel a bit silly saying that people are awkward because they 'don't move properly' because its sounds like the bullshido 'No don't attack me like that, like this...'. However, you're absolutely right learning how to move is very important and doesn't come naturally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coach Josh View Post
    This is one reason for the side stepping method. After awhile I was taught it like Okano Sensei is demonstrating but only after some proficiency in Judo was developed.

    Secondly look at a class that Okano Sensei is instructing and tell me how many white belts are in that class.
    Well I think Okuri ashi barai shouldn't be introduced until realtively late in the kyu grade learning process say 3rd/2nd kyu + because of its complexity.

    As you say you wouldn't teach it the Okano way to a bunch of white belts, but then again why would anyone teach a class of white belts Okuri ashi barai?

    I actually think that the side skipping method is much harder and requires much greater proficiency in Judo thank the Okano method. Its very easy to mess up, the dynamic delay is much harder to achieve and the co-ordination of hands and feet is much more difficult. You need a really good uke to make it work.

    Whereas, I feel, that the Okano method taught in the staggered progression I outlined earlier in the thread overcomes most of these issues and even working with a poor uke can be achievable.
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