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  1. danbones is offline

    Featherweight

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
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    48

    Posted On:
    12/19/2007 9:14pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I can only comment based on my experience as I do not speak for the school. Beginners do not spar stand up very much. That is to say in my first 9 months or so, my class did not activly spar. The intermediate students spar just about every class, sometimes lower intensity and sometimes medium intensity. The advanced students have actually thrown each other through the wall and sometimes blood happens.

    Grappling involves sparring type drills every class all levels and there is usually open mat after class.

    Progress testing in both but more so in grappling is sparring based, the higher the level the more intense the session.
  2. danbones is offline

    Featherweight

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    Dec 2007
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    Posted On:
    12/19/2007 9:55pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by UpaLumpa
    Oh, also, considering that these schools look to be in the general Chicago area why would I go to Victory and not to one of the many mma schools led by a bjj blackbelt?
    I can only answer that for me.

    If you where moving to Chicago and you asked me about MMA training. I would encourage you to go to interview as many schools as possible because there are many awesome schools here. I train at VMAA because of the instruction and the reputation of Sifu Dion. Because they have an excellent staff. In my opinion Sifu Dion is the best in the area. I also think that VMAA has an unbelievable children's program.

    I guess at one time I knew about belts and credentials, I see them hanging on the wall. I've got what is important to me and I'd urge you to go through that same process and find what is best for you.

    Again, I did not start posting to encourage everyone to sign up at VMAA. I started posting because I read a post that I know to be untrue. I thought the post was unfairly negative, false and disrespectful. That is all. Your questions though are fair and straight forward.
  3. KFighter is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    511

    Posted On:
    12/19/2007 10:01pm


     Style: BJJ/Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    BTT Chicago, Carlson Gracie, POW, New Breed, Gracie Barra, Jeff Neal, Joe Goitya, Shidokan > VMAA
  4. huge is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Edmonton
    Posts
    260

    Posted On:
    12/19/2007 11:02pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by danbones
    I do believe that talk is cheap especially in this forum where we lack face to face conviction and have so may whining about anecdotal versus verifiable evidence.
    I'm not trying to dispute anything anymore, but, in a forum where there is a disagreement to something verifiable (fees, for example), anecdotal evidence is unacceptable. It was a case of he said, he said. I have no more reason to believe you any more than I do the other guy. I was unclear in what I was asking for.

    Either way, I'm past it. Carry on.
  5. judoxchris is offline

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2

    Posted On:
    12/20/2007 12:15am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Jeet Kune Do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by huge
    I mentioned that you posted it. No reading problem here. However, I did mention that anecdotes are not evidence. You must have missed that.
    If you do not want an anecdote for you feel that it is not sufficient evidence, then why not come in to to the VMAA and speak with one who will give you the information you are seaking up and front rather than searching for it via internet. If you have the time to argue this topic over long periods of time on the computer, is it that hard to get up and find out this information through the school itself?
  6. judoxchris is offline

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2

    Posted On:
    12/20/2007 12:25am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Jeet Kune Do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by UpaLumpa
    While stupid pricing and stupider philosophy are fun to talk about, is there anything to suggest that this school does or does not produce competent fighters?

    Victory people, do your members compete in grappling events, mma, sport jujutsu, pankration etc?
    http://www.victorymartialarts.typepad.com/
    Well if you watch the video on this website it has an interview with one of the students from VMAA. As for the competent fighters... why not check the place out for yourself?
  7. Sam Browning is offline

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    9,864

    Posted On:
    12/20/2007 12:51am

    hall of famestaff
     

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Because he's half way across the country.
  8. huge is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Edmonton
    Posts
    260

    Posted On:
    12/20/2007 12:51am


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by judoxchris


    If you do not want an anecdote for you feel that it is not sufficient evidence, then why not come in to to the VMAA and speak with one who will give you the information you are seaking up and front rather than searching for it via internet. If you have the time to argue this topic over long periods of time on the computer, is it that hard to get up and find out this information through the school itself?
    I'm not in Chicago. The point isn't about the prices anyway, it's about verifying claims. In this case it was about pricing, Two claims were made no one was backing them up with anything more than "I said the price is "X" that should be good enough for you.". A claim made on the internet means nothing without something verifiable. That's the point.

    Edit for clarity: Freepunch made a claim about fees, DanBones made an opposing claim. Who's story should I believe without providing proof?
    Last edited by huge; 12/20/2007 12:56am at .
  9. saman is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    242

    Posted On:
    12/20/2007 7:03am


     Style: TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by huge
    I'm not in Chicago. The point isn't about the prices anyway, it's about verifying claims. In this case it was about pricing, Two claims were made no one was backing them up with anything more than "I said the price is "X" that should be good enough for you.". A claim made on the internet means nothing without something verifiable. That's the point.

    Edit for clarity: Freepunch made a claim about fees, DanBones made an opposing claim. Who's story should I believe without providing proof?

    Wait, wait, wait! WTH are you talking about??? We have people on various monthly fees depending on LOTS of scenarios: What were the fees when that person started? How much did they put down over the minimum? Are they a verifiably economically disadvantaged family with a child who has received a reduced fee (by me, the school owner who is interested in the welfare of the local community and feels led to give a private discount) in order for the child to be able to receive the benefits of tma? Did they just plain bargain harder??? After all, nearly every large purchase should be negotiated - when was the last time you bought a car?? Get real. Just because Dan pays "X" doesn't mean **** about what another student may be paying. And THAT's called business! Further, unless a school is touting that they are training a student to get into professional fighting, then "quality" is fairly subjective. I have a problem with belt mills like choi kwang do who claim that their style will cure every illness and make a 68 year old beginner a great street fighter. I have problems with groups like Tae Yun Kim's COL who seem to be exploiting students. I have problems with instructors who teach in Y's and church basements and their garages (and sometimes in a storefront dojang) who claim rank they don't have and claim to teach the correct form of a tma (a specific style of karate, or tkd or kung fu), but teach it incorrectly. I have problems with the people who claim they can teach some scared woman gun and knife disarms in three classes and such ****. But, lots of professional schools charge a fair price and students enjoy classes, gain pretty good self-defense skills, get more flexible and have enjoy health benefits from the exercise etc. People who want more need to do their due diligence and check things out instead of being a dumbass, signing up and then deciding they really wanted something different.:eusa_naug
  10. danbones is offline

    Featherweight

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    48

    Posted On:
    12/20/2007 8:38am

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by KFighter
    BTT Chicago, Carlson Gracie, POW, New Breed, Gracie Barra, Jeff Neal, Joe Goitya, Shidokan > VMAA
    Interesting Kfighter that you would have the opinion that all those dojo's are better than another but you have not settled your training in at any one or two of the real good ones and in fact are still asking around in forums about even more local gyms.

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