Justin Kagan & his Budo ( Taitokudo )?

**The Juggernoob** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 6:48pm

Originally Posted by shuukazedojo

My grandfather was also involved in Judo, Jiujitsu, and some Aikido.

Your grandfather was involved in Jiu-Jitsu?
Also, this thread tastes of weeaboo.

**Tom Kagan** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 8:20pm

Originally Posted by Tom .C

In all fairness, it's that last name.. "Kagan" that makes everything suspect.

Kagan is a name to which several longer names were truncated by the officials at Ellis Island. These families mostly came from the Poland, Ukraine, and Russian areas of Northeastern Europe and Northern Asia, although some came from North Africa and the Middle East.

There is no relation between Justin and me.

**** you. Vete a la mierda tambien.

**shuukazedojo** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:16pm

@maofas: I suppose anything can appear fishy with the right eyes. Do you have some examples of lesser known styles with these minimal resources? Maybe understanding how their information is distributed will lead me to an understanding of how to find my own lineage. ...no names yet. My family is helping me find some old records that may lead to that and hopefully some contact with either the couple or their descendants. ...The hall of fame thing was something I was nominated for by my instructor at the time while studying Muso Shinden Ryu.

@Yoj: I understand what you're saying. I'm not concerned about being "taken seriously in the real iaido world." My swordsmanship speaks for itself. The kata may be different, but the skill is discernible. Beyond that, we can have a whole discussion about the reality of those circles. How many of them actually practice real swordsmanship? Many sword dojo only teach kata, te saya waza, and the occasional kumitachi. Tachiuchi is left by the wayside or done with padded swords. Furthermore, some schools don't even practice tameshigiri in any form. How can a school be dedicated to swordsmanship and not cut??? Breathing and meditation has been watered down to mere focus exercises and the deeper understanding of many concepts has been "Americanized" so as not to offend anyone. Again, this is a topic for another thread, but to call them "real" is sometimes a bit of a stretch, imo.

@bigmike_ebw: yes. I'm sure that was through the Judo club, either directly or in partnership. His certificate is signed by William Laub sensei and William Kiely sensei. They had a group out of St. Louis called the Rakkasans. ...not sure what weeaboo is...maybe you'd care to enlighten me

@Toms: I think I'll second that. Pretty sure there's no relation. In any case, the grandfather we're discussing is on my mother's side. Kagan was my father's name.

**The Juggernoob** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:20pm

weeaboos are japanophiles. Google it.

My question was that you said your grandfather studied JIU-JITSU?

**shuukazedojo** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:23pm

Gotcha. And, yes, that's what the certificate says. Midwest Society of Jiu-Jitsu from 1971. Why do you ask?

**The Juggernoob** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:26pm

Jiu-Jitsu is the Brazilian spelling, it indicates that the style is not japanese. (Not always).
Just checking your grandfather wasnt 20 years too early. Jujitsu is the Jap spelling.
This isnt set it stone or anything, it was just worth checking.

**shuukazedojo** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:26pm

BTW, I don't think of myself as Japanese or mispronounce words as this term implies. I study a Japanese Cultural Art and simply choose to not exclude the culture for the sake of marketability, popularity, or inconvenience.

**shuukazedojo** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:29pm

Originally Posted by bigmike_ebw

Jiu-Jitsu is the Brazilian spelling, it indicates that the style is not japanese. (Not always).
Just checking your grandfather wasnt 20 years too early. Jujitsu is the Jap spelling.
This isnt set it stone or anything, it was just worth checking.

Like you said, not set in stone. I'm 99% sure this was not Brazilian. It wouldn't make sense. As previously mentioned, this was almost definitely in conjunction with the Judo club. The certificate reflects a Japanese, not Brazilian, style. Ranking terms are Japanese, etc.

**The Juggernoob** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 9:33pm

Ahh, fantastic. I apologise for inconveniencing you, and thank you for tolerating my pedantic nature.

**Tom .C** · Posted On: 6/12/2011 10:09pm

Originally Posted by Tom Kagan

Kagan is a name to which several longer names were truncated by the officials at Ellis Island. These families mostly came from the Poland, Ukraine, and Russian areas of Northeastern Europe and Northern Asia, although some came from North Africa and the Middle East.

There is no relation between Justin and me.

**** you. Vete a la mierda tambien.

Mi perro es in el arbol!