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  1. BackFistMonkey is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 1:20pm

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     Style: Recovery-Fu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lebell View Post
    i dunno how many of you actually slit the throat of a living creature?
    I did it and its harder then you think, you sorta saw aswell.
    The movement on the vid was one 'clean' move, it looked relatively shallow to me.
    Then again im only used to animals.
    Oh he fucked it up alright ... but he tried ... and kept his knife.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhi108 View Post
    Nuke a unborn gay whale for Christ.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994
  2. Mr. Machette is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 1:43pm

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     Style: FMA, Ego Warrior

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    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    ...and posters wonder why we tend to insult most SD knife defense classes.
    Your right.

    Can't win, don't try.

    Best just to curl into the fetal position and **** yourself.
  3. Prince Vlad is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 1:52pm


     Style: BJJ n stuff

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    Quote Originally Posted by Backfistmonkey View Post
    Not to derail but weren't you trying to convince me that Krav's knife and gun defense were realistic and useful ... that was rhetorical by the way ...

    I know it was you I just can't think of which thread it was to quote you exactly. .
    Twas me probably somewhere going on about Krav. Nothing possible you could do against a guy who cuts your throat from behind and to be honest, most people would have just stared at the guy approach them in a kind of slow motion W...T....F... trying to register what they just witnessed. Hard to say what I would have done in the same situation, would I have blocked the knife and taken a few slices to the forearms rather than a few puncture wounds to the body? No clue. Would I still prefer to have at least drilled with partners who are doing their best to 'stab' me with a rubber knife before something like this happens. Absolutely. Do I think SD against knives is going to save you in a fight, not really but it's worth having some kind of training to increase your odds of survival. The difference with this video compared to the usual SD setup is that the guy couldn't run away, he was in a confined space and was facing someone who wanted to murder him. The sad truth is a lot of SD people believe that they could easily defeat a knife wielding attacker when the opposite is the case. Still doesn't mean you shouldn't train to increase your chances of survival.
    Last edited by Prince Vlad; 10/08/2010 2:01pm at .
  4. Odacon is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 1:57pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If I'm honest I'm worried that if a situation like that unfolded in front of me I might freeze or run away instead of helping.
  5. BackFistMonkey is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 2:06pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Machette View Post
    Your right.

    Can't win, don't try.

    Best just to curl into the fetal position and **** yourself.
    OH **** yeah. The best knife defense is just to shoot yourself in the temple.

    I know you FMA guys just do those one and two step drills over an over again with prearranged attacks and defense with no actually knowledge of knife free play.

    All theory based being taught by weekend seminar instructors right?

    The stuff you learn is the same stuff you learn from the weekly selfdefense course the local TKD or Karate joint right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhi108 View Post
    Nuke a unborn gay whale for Christ.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994
  6. BackFistMonkey is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 2:23pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Nahhhhh not what you were saying before man.

    You defended the concept of dead drills and the idea of trying to "win" a knife attack or gun threat. You even defended the whole bare hand vs automatic rifle bit. When people laughed at it.

    That **** gets people killed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Vlad View Post
    Twas me probably somewhere going on about Krav. Nothing possible you could do against a guy who cuts your throat from behind and to be honest, most people would have just stared at the guy approach them in a kind of slow motion W...T....F... trying to register what they just witnessed. Hard to say what I would have done in the same situation, would I have blocked the knife and taken a few slices to the forearms rather than a few puncture wounds to the body? No clue. Would I still prefer to have at least drilled with partners who are doing their best to 'stab' me with a rubber knife before something like this happens. Absolutely. Do I think SD against knives is going to save you in a fight, not really but it's worth having some kind of training to increase your odds of survival. The difference with this video compared to the usual SD setup is that the guy couldn't run away, he was in a confined space and was facing someone who wanted to murder him. The sad truth is a lot of SD people believe that they could easily defeat a knife wielding attacker when the opposite is the case. Still doesn't mean you shouldn't train to increase your chances of survival.
    Self defense against a knife is a battle to control the blade and survive. Period.

    You are not kicking/chopping/slapping knives out of hands or neatly turning your shoulders to let a #1 thrust to the chest slide by. **** is going to be crazy, messy, cluster fucked, and over about the time it starts.

    If you are drilling and working with knife defense with a magic marker, no script, and no limits on where the fight goes or stays (standing or ground) you are doing it right.

    Just about anything else and you are just trying to fool yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhi108 View Post
    Nuke a unborn gay whale for Christ.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994
  7. Mr. Machette is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 2:28pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Backfistmonkey View Post
    I know you FMA guys just do those one and two step drills over an over again with prearranged attacks and defense with no actually knowledge of knife free play.
    I learn all my knife defense from watching Shaw bothers movies.

    Way to just make some wild assumptions there bud.

    Actually, sir, I "free spar" with random people at every opportunity. As they will do anything but what was covered in your drills. They will also do it at a realistic speed, as in, "to fast to grab their wrist and throw them".

    What I take issue with is the assumption than any defensive training is useless.

    Will it prevent you from being injured? Probably not. But at the very least, it may give you the courage and impetus to act defensively, instead of just freezing in fear and being cut to ribbons.

    Three things this video demonstrates admirably:

    a) Your going to get cut when knives come out. Period.

    b) Most "knife fights" are not actually fights, but vicious stabbings, where the unlucky person doesn't know a knife is in play until it's too late. (These I have seen a couple times in person.)

    c) The knife did not incapacitate instantly, but the gun did. Big time.
  8. BackFistMonkey is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 2:36pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Machette View Post
    I learn all my knife defense from watching Shaw bothers movies.
    ^5
    Way to just make some wild assumptions there bud.
    I was being facetious to make a point
    Actually, sir, I "free spar" with random people at every opportunity. As they will do anything but what was covered in your drills. They will also do it at a realistic speed, as in, "to fast to grab their wrist and throw them".
    I would hope so ... in general people with a real FMA lineage tend to do small and medium length blade work better than most.
    What I take issue with is the assumption than any defensive training is useless.
    Please see my above post where I elaborate and give a more serious train of thought to the topic
    Will it prevent you from being injured? Probably not. But at the very least, it may give you the courage and impetus to act defensively, instead of just freezing in fear and being cut to ribbons.
    Depends ... if you train it right you are correct. If you have been trained wrong it is teaching you jump into a situation you only think you know about and can handle.
    Three things this video demonstrates admirably:

    a) Your going to get cut when knives come out. Period.

    b) Most "knife fights" are not actually fights, but vicious stabbings, where the unlucky person doesn't know a knife is in play until it's too late. (These I have seen a couple times in person.)

    c) The knife did not incapacitate instantly, but the gun did. Big time.
    Amen brother.

    I was very happy when I found this specifically because it covers those three points (and more that have not been brought up yet).
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhi108 View Post
    Nuke a unborn gay whale for Christ.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994
  9. gregaquaman is online now
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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 2:36pm

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     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Machette View Post
    I learn all my knife defense from watching Shaw bothers movies.

    Way to just make some wild assumptions there bud.

    Actually, sir, I "free spar" with random people at every opportunity. As they will do anything but what was covered in your drills. They will also do it at a realistic speed, as in, "to fast to grab their wrist and throw them".

    What I take issue with is the assumption than any defensive training is useless.

    Will it prevent you from being injured? Probably not. But at the very least, it may give you the courage and impetus to act defensively, instead of just freezing in fear and being cut to ribbons.

    Three things this video demonstrates admirably:

    a) Your going to get cut when knives come out. Period.

    b) Most "knife fights" are not actually fights, but vicious stabbings, where the unlucky person doesn't know a knife is in play until it's too late. (These I have seen a couple times in person.)

    c) The knife did not incapacitate instantly, but the gun did. Big time.
    Of course I could also probbly find a whole heap of vids where people get ambushed and bashed with no chance to retaliate and therfore prove martial arts in general is a chocolate teapot.

    Training wise for knives I would drill and spar. just like any thing else
  10. Permalost is online now
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    10/08/2010 2:46pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Backfistmonkey View Post
    I would hope so ... in general people with a real FMA lineage tend to do small and medium length blade work better than most.
    Conversely, people with a real FMA lineage are more likely to be knowledgeable about the advantages of a big knife and are more likely to own a few very good fighting knives.
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