Jay Russell - Albany,NY - Questions about his BJJ Black Belt and BJJ lineage.

**Rock Ape** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 2:58pm

Originally Posted by Dojostormz

Dude.... thats JORDAN DAMON wearing a BB, not Jay Russell. Remember how he was just supposed to have gotten it last week? That picture and article are from 2009.

I am actually doing Mr. Russell's work for him right now.

And are you forgetting the information posted earlier in the the thread where it was suggested (but not yet proved) that Damon was already a black belt before his most recent promotion.

I'd say that your photo still proves nothing at this pont and you're jumping to conclusions you still have yet to physically substantiate.

**Dojostormz** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 3:02pm

Originally Posted by Simio de las Rocas

So is your focus shifting from Russell to Damon now ?

My focus is to get to the bottom of this and sort out all the details of this incredibly strange lineage problem. I don't care where that ends as long as we get answers.

Ken Kronenberg said that Damon just got his BB. Mr. Anthony insisted there was evidence showing that Mr. Damon wore a BB long before that. I searched and have verified that. Do you not think it adds to the investigation as to what on earth is going on here?

It seems that now we need to know two things. Who if anyone gave that BB to Jordan Damon, and whether Mr. Damon honestly gave a BB to Mr. Russell. I think both of these are important questions to answer.

**Dojostormz** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 3:04pm

Originally Posted by Simio de las Rocas

And are you forgetting the information posted earlier in the the thread where it was suggested (but not yet proved) that Damon was already a black belt before his most recent promotion.

I'd say that your photo still proves nothing at this pont and you're jumping to conclusions you still have yet to physically substantiate.

Okay, I understand what you're saying. I just figured a picture of him actually wearing a BB was better than hearsay that he had worn a BB. That claim was unsubstantiated before I posted that picture.

**Rock Ape** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 3:06pm

Originally Posted by Dojostormz

It seems that now we need to know two things. Who if anyone gave that BB to Jordan Damon, and whether Mr. Damon honestly gave a BB to Mr. Russell. I think both of these are important questions to answer.

I identified that I asked for this information earlier in the thread.

Several posts later, we've not moved on.

**It is Fake** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 3:21pm

Originally Posted by Simio de las Rocas

What does posting a picture of the guy wearing a Black Belt prove in a situation where the man in question believes HE IS IN FACT A BLACK BELT ?

It isn't the Black Belt it is the date of the article that is important.

**Rock Ape** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 3:33pm

I understand that, but we'd already established (rightly or wrongly) from Mr. Anthony the owner of the venue where Russell works, that Damon was apparently a Black Belt before his recent promotion.

It is only reasonable to assume therefore that a person with a previously awarded Black Belt would wear it, unless of course he was requested not too by his current teacher but that point isn't in contention so it's moot.

**It is Fake** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 3:45pm

Not going to argue in the thread. Dojostormz what you posted was fine. Simo knows that these threads become information dumps. Go ahead and post what you find just leave the excess commentary alone.

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 9/22/2010 7:43pm

Originally Posted by Simio de las Rocas

I understand that, but we'd already established (rightly or wrongly) from Mr. Anthony the owner of the venue where Russell works, that Damon was apparently a Black Belt before his recent promotion.

It is only reasonable to assume therefore that a person with a previously awarded Black Belt would wear it, unless of course he was requested not too by his current teacher but that point isn't in contention so it's moot.

Ah, David. Did Mr. Anthony claim that Damon was a black belt in BJJ? I thought he was promoted to first degree black belt in BJJ. If say he had previously earned a black belt in Karate, and was teaching BJJ while wearing a karate black belt, that would be quite potentially deceptive. But if he were promoted to second degree black belt in BJJ, under confederation rules that would require a 4th degree black belt in BJJ to promote him.

**Rock Ape** · Posted On: 9/23/2010 7:39am

Originally Posted by Samuel Browning

Ah, David. Did Mr. Anthony claim that Damon was a black belt in BJJ? I thought he was promoted to first degree black belt in BJJ. If say he had previously earned a black belt in Karate, and was teaching BJJ while wearing a karate black belt, that would be quite potentially deceptive. But if he were promoted to second degree black belt in BJJ, under confederation rules that would require a 4th degree black belt in BJJ to promote him.

Hi Sam.

Indeed however, I am extending the benefit of the doubt To Mr. Damon at this point although what you highlight hasn't been discounted as a possibility.

Additionally Mr. Anthony states: (Emphasis mine)

Jay [Russell] began training Brazilian Jiu Jitsu under Tai Kai Black Belt Jordan Damon at Tai Kai Jiu Jitsu

Jordan [Damon] just officially became a Phil Migliarese black belt, previously he was a Tai Kai black belt.

I am therefore working on the assumption (for the time being) that Mr. Damon was previously graded to Black Belt in BJJ before his most recent promotion.

Like I said, I haven't discounted the possibility that Mr. Damon was a BB in a different art, if that is (was) the case, that opens up another issue which as yet, hasn't been directly questioned.

The questions previously posed [by me] which will clarify part of this issue have yet to be answered.

**Dojostormz** · Posted On: 9/23/2010 8:19am

I have again emailed Mr Kronenberg, head of Tai Kai, asking if he can give more specific information on possible previous BB's or to refer Mr. Damon to me. To reiterate, he has already stated that Mr. Damon just received his BB from Tai Kai JJ/Team Balance.

It is certainly possible that Mr. Damon had a BB before. Yet, it is incredibly unlikely that it was from Tai Kai as Mr. Anthony claimed, based on what Mr. Kronenberg has said.