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  1. Plasma is offline
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    1/13/2014 1:50pm

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     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Estima Lock

    The past year I been working heavily on my Heel Hook as they are legal in most Advanced No-Gi in the States. However, in Europe the Heel Hook tend to be banned even in Advanced No-Gi. So this lately I been think of refocusing on the toe hold using the RNC grip or what people refer to as the Estima Lock. Any one has success or failure with this style of toe hold. It really seems like a devastating counter to the DLR/RDLR game.

    Last edited by Plasma; 1/13/2014 1:53pm at .
  2. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/13/2014 9:57pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I played around with this a little in practice the other night, after seeing this video. Although the position of the locking arm is much better than in traditional BJJ compression locks, I still feel like this is mostly an extension of that original compression lock that doesn't work past white belt.

    I am positive I'm missing something, but I have yet to find what that is. Insight?
  3. DKJr is offline
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    Fasten your seat belts, and prepare for lift off

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    Posted On:
    1/13/2014 11:02pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    I played around with this a little in practice the other night, after seeing this video. Although the position of the locking arm is much better than in traditional BJJ compression locks, I still feel like this is mostly an extension of that original compression lock that doesn't work past white belt.

    I am positive I'm missing something, but I have yet to find what that is. Insight?
    The toes are against your chest/stomach, provides that leverage Helio invented.
  4. The Cap is offline
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    ORNYTHORINQUE!... BOIT-SANS-SOIF!... BACHI-BOUZOUK!

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 1:14am

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    Quote Originally Posted by DKJr View Post
    provides that leverage Helio invented.
    Espèce de lutteur d'eau douce.
  5. Plasma is offline
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 1:16am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    I played around with this a little in practice the other night, after seeing this video. Although the position of the locking arm is much better than in traditional BJJ compression locks, I still feel like this is mostly an extension of that original compression lock that doesn't work past white belt.

    I am positive I'm missing something, but I have yet to find what that is. Insight?

    Considering the Estima Brothers are hitting this at the Black Belt level and at ADCC I would disagree.

    It is not a compression lock, it's a Toe Hold where the RNC grip is used to secure the foot against the body and the body is used to bring the toes to their butt like a traditional Toe Hold.
  6. The Cap is offline
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    ORNYTHORINQUE!... BOIT-SANS-SOIF!... BACHI-BOUZOUK!

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 1:29am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Caveat: this move is new to me.

    I was having trouble visualizing how this would be executed at all, but I see that the opponent's shin doesn't have to be pushed away from your body, you just flatten the whole leg and foot against yourself. That limits the range in which you could torque the ankle, right? After flattening it out there is nowhere to go. Does the submission then come from compression pain or is flattening out the foot enough to injure most people?
  7. Plasma is offline
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 1:36am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Cap View Post
    Caveat: this move is new to me.

    I was having trouble visualizing how this would be executed at all, but I see that the opponent's shin doesn't have to be pushed away from your body, you just flatten the whole leg and foot against yourself. That limits the range in which you could torque the ankle, right? After flattening it out there is nowhere to go. Does the submission then come from compression pain or is flattening out the foot enough to injure most people?
    Its a Toe Hold. The toes are locked against the body with the RNC grip and Body turns to make the angle of bringing the toes towards the opponents butt as per a regular toe hold.
  8. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 9:30am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Plasma View Post
    Considering the Estima Brothers are hitting this at the Black Belt level and at ADCC I would disagree.

    It is not a compression lock, it's a Toe Hold where the RNC grip is used to secure the foot against the body and the body is used to bring the toes to their butt like a traditional Toe Hold.
    It's not really an agree/disagree thing. I just said I didn't understand it and asked for insight. On first glance, the video didn't seem clear on where the toes were, hence my request for insight.

    Thanks for the clarification, DKJr.
  9. Plasma is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 11:23am

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    It's not really an agree/disagree thing. I just said I didn't understand it and asked for insight. On first glance, the video didn't seem clear on where the toes were, hence my request for insight.

    Thanks for the clarification, DKJr.
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk
    Although the position of the locking arm is much better than in traditional BJJ compression locks, I still feel like this is mostly an extension of that original compression lock that doesn't work past white belt.
    I was disagreeing with this
  10. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/14/2014 12:27pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Plasma View Post
    I was disagreeing with this
    Right, of course. And I was saying that at first glance, it looked like a compression lock with a better grip.

    Now that you guys have clarified, I noticed upon re-watching the video that the toes are trapped against the body, mimicking the operative action of a toehold. Pretty cool.
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