Fighting may have shaped evolution of human hand

**DCS** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 11:21am

Someone is looking for a IG Nobel, methinks.

Fighting may have shaped the evolution of the human hand, according to a new study by a US team.

The University of Utah researchers used instruments to measure the forces and acceleration when martial artists hit a punch bag.

They found that the structure of the fist provides support that increases the ability of the knuckles to transmit "punching" force.

Details have been published in the Journal of Experimental Biology.

More info:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-20790294
http://jeb.biologists.org/content/216/2/i.1

Full paper: Protective buttressing of the human fist and the evolution of hominin hands

**DarkPhoenix** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 11:42am

A friend of mine sent me this article yesterday. Interesting theory.

**DCS** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 11:46am

Here is a disagreement:

http://phenomena.nationalgeographic....lved-to-fight/

**Vieux Normand** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 12:16pm

To what degree has the ability to fistfight (compared to, say, the ability to develop and wield weapons) played any role in evolutionary and/or history-making events among humans? What's the actual evidence? Right.

**Permalost** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 12:46pm

Originally Posted by Vieux Normand

To what degree has the ability to fistfight (compared to, say, the ability to develop and wield weapons) played any role in evolutionary and/or history-making events among humans? What's the actual evidence? Right.

From the NatGeo article:

The problem is that, as Carrier and Morgan write, the goal of their study was “to test the hypothesis that the proportions of the human hand make it an effective weapon”. They did that. But the hypothesis that fist-fights shaped the evolution of our hand is different. Going from one to the other is like showing that computers are good at surfing the Web, and suggesting that this is what they were invented to do. It involves speculative just-so stories—stories that may well be correct, but that need evidence.

**DCS** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 1:02pm

Originally Posted by Vieux Normand

To what degree has the ability to fistfight (compared to, say, the ability to develop and wield weapons) played any role in evolutionary and/or history-making events among humans? What's the actual evidence? Right.

My hypothesis is fist fighting played a role in ancient intragroup violence: Social order without using "the deadly" for a seriously injured or maimed member of the hunter-gathering group is not very useful.

Evidence? I have none.

**Vieux Normand** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 1:06pm

Originally Posted by DCS

My hypothesis is fist fighting played a role in ancient intragroup violence: Social order without using "the deadly" for a seriously injured or maimed member of the hunter-gathering group is not very useful.

Evidence? I have none.

Well, since we're going the entirely-hypothetical route: if what happens among other group-mammalian species (wolves, chimps, and so on) is any indication, then actual fighting didn't occur anywhere near as often as posturing and the threat of such. Actual fights were rare. If threats were more common, a species specializing in wielding hand-held weapons would use them for that.

**Permalost** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 1:07pm

The shin is an even better bone for striking with but I doubt it evolved that way so Thai people could kick each other.

**crappler** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 1:15pm

No. The human hand (and especially the opposable thumb), was designed to grip objects. Not punch stuff. Didn't you guys ever see 2001? Geez!!!! I got a PHD in anthropology from Hollywoodz!!!

**crappler** · Posted On: 12/21/2012 1:16pm

Originally Posted by Vieux Normand

Well, since we're going the entirely-hypothetical route: if what happens among other group-mammalian species (wolves, chimps, and so on) is any indication, then actual fighting didn't occur anywhere near as often as posturing and the threat of such. Actual fights were rare. If threats were more common, a species specializing in wielding hand-held weapons would use them for that.

I am so fucking awesome at puffing up and getting quiet and scary (and slinking away in fear) I have never really been in a fight.