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  1. VeritasVS is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/12/2012 2:16am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Aikido and Iaijutsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Applying Sword Form to Cane

    Since I didn't feel going through the trouble of necroing a few RATHER old threads, I decided I would post a new one. I have seen in many cases where people have asked what the relevance of practicing sword arts in our modern age is. I could be very wrong, but I have a few theories on this, being a sword-lover myself.

    First off, it could be out of pure interest in the weapon. This could branch off into sub-catagories, but I will keep it as is.

    Secondly, one could be practicing it as either a long tradition of their heritage or in deep respect of a historical era.

    Thirdly, there are many who feel a spiritual connection with certain movements, sometimes with particular weapons. I feel a deep connection with the sword.

    I believe that all of these boil down into the fact that people WILL study sword in some way or another. How do they justify it? Many will justify it as pure interest or as discipline, but there are those of us who believe the sword can still have martial application. I will NOT go into the "Zombie Apocalypse" super-fad people have gotten into.

    It is true that we cannot carry a sword around anymore and the technology is far inferior to modern firearms. However, in many places, it is legal to own a sword in your home. I believe that a sword could make a great self defense weapon in the home (obviously a gun is better, though). It is a weapon that sword enthusiasts will often have nearby if a situation happened.

    Now, for when out and about, if one does not have a carry permit for a firearm, or just wishes to save that for a last resort, one can easily apply their sword form training to a cane. I actually intend to form a cane from an oak dowel and I believe it would work well. Yes, one can easily just learn a cane form and carry a cane, but if one wishes to study sword for whatever reason, then sword forms are effective with canes as well.

    This was just a line of thought I was sorting through and figured I would share what was on my mind. What do you all think?
  2. BryanW is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/12/2012 2:33am


     Style: French Smallsword

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "Fighting" canes are made from specific woods and can break if not made properly....then again they can break anyway. I know Cold Steel makes some sort of fiberglass "city stick" as well but have never tried it and don't know about the quality.

    There's several different styles of cane fighting such as those found in canne de combat which is often taught alongside Savate, french baton, Irish shillelagh fighting, Vigny cane fighting system (found in Baritsu, influenced probably from Savate and la canne), Eskrima, singlestick, and other eastern martial arts I know teach cane fighting (I'm just not familiar with them but I'm sure google will turn a few up).

    If I recall, some of the western styles use singlestick techniques which originated as a training tool for the backsword. So if you're looking for direct sword to cane techniques I'd look at the singlestick and study backsword as well.


    EDIT: Regarding legality of beating someone with a cane I can't speak about. Probably varies state to state.
    Last edited by BryanW; 1/12/2012 2:34am at . Reason: final comment
  3. VeritasVS is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/12/2012 2:42am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Aikido and Iaijutsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thank you for the info! Backsword would be nice for looking into! I was also thinking that one could apply styles such as iaijutsu, kendo, or any other kenjutsu to a cane as well, thus slightly amplifying the relevance of studying sword. But perhaps it is silly to try to justify sword training. And as for your comment on legality, I am not quite sure on that either.

    It would be like fighting with a bokken :)
    Last edited by VeritasVS; 1/12/2012 2:44am at . Reason: Additional comment
  4. Bneterasedmynam is online now

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    Posted On:
    1/15/2012 8:20am


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you are going to use a cane for defense I think it would be better if you practiced a cane style rather than a sword style. Sword styles do not translate well into blunt weapons.
  5. Chili Pepper is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/16/2012 9:39am


     Style: Siling Labuyo Arnis

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by BryanW View Post
    "Fighting" canes are made from specific woods and can break if not made properly....then again they can break anyway. I know Cold Steel makes some sort of fiberglass "city stick" as well but have never tried it and don't know about the quality.
    I have the Cold Steel 'blackthorn' cane, which is polypropelene. Ain't no way you're going to use it as you would a sword - the balance and feel is just completely different. That said, hitting someone with it would definitely ruin their day.

    EDIT: Regarding legality of beating someone with a cane I can't speak about. Probably varies state to state.
    If you use it as a weapon, it's a weapon. If you beat someone to death with a toaster, it's just as illegal as using a club. The advantage of a cane is that you can carry it without legal complications.
  6. ChenPengFi is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/16/2012 9:49am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Hung Gar, Choy Lay Fut

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    I want one of these:
  7. Permalost is offline
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    1/16/2012 12:03pm

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think the cane as a defensive weapon is usually better deployed more like a bayonet than a sword. Kinda like what these guys are doing:


    It sounds like you're also sticking another point about using a sword for home defense as well. While I'm sure it could work, such a person should consider if their sword can be used effectively inside, in a hallway for example. Those lovers-of-the-sword the samurai would not use their katana as their indoor weapon.
    Thirdly, there are many who feel a spiritual connection with certain movements, sometimes with particular weapons. I feel a deep connection with the sword.
    Why is that?
  8. gregaquaman is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/16/2012 12:38pm


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chili Pepper View Post
    I have the Cold Steel 'blackthorn' cane, which is polypropelene. Ain't no way you're going to use it as you would a sword - the balance and feel is just completely different. That said, hitting someone with it would definitely ruin their day.



    If you use it as a weapon, it's a weapon. If you beat someone to death with a toaster, it's just as illegal as using a club. The advantage of a cane is that you can carry it without legal complications.
    I have one ordered. (In response to the baseball bat knife thread actually) are they any good?

    Do they work as a cane?
  9. Rock Ape is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/16/2012 1:31pm

    staff
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bneterasedmynam View Post
    If you are going to use a cane for defense I think it would be better if you practiced a cane style rather than a sword style. Sword styles do not translate well into blunt weapons.
    Two things..

    Alter your style field to indicate what method of "sword fighting" you study and second.. It all depends upon what type of sword technique we're talking about.

    Japanese sword (generically speaking) translates VERY WELL to use of a stick, you only have to look at what you can do with a bokuto to realise this however, generally, if you can "cut" you can strike with a wooden weapon, if you can "stab" you can thrust with a wooden weapon, blocks and parries are pretty much the same regardless.

    Indeed there's a few things you can do with a wooden weapon you perhaps can't with a blade thus, there's a degree more versatility.

    In short, you talk bollocks.
    "To sin by silence when one should protest makes cowards out of men".

    ~Ella Wheeler
  10. Chili Pepper is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/16/2012 1:40pm


     Style: Siling Labuyo Arnis

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by gregaquaman View Post
    I have one ordered. (In response to the baseball bat knife thread actually) are they any good?
    They're awesome. It feels like you're wielding a dinosaur-killing meteorite.

    Do they work as a cane?
    Very well. To suit my height/arm length, I cut off about 3" from the bottom.

    (stand at attention. Turn the cane upside down, and hold it next to you with what would normally be the top end on the floor. With your arm at your side, mark where the cane reaches the crease of your wrist. Cut it a little longer than this mark. Walk around with it for a bit to see if you need to cut off more, and if you do need to trim it, only do so in half-inch increments)

    I added a turk's head knot a couple inches from the bottom as a stopper.
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