Conversation Between BKR and jadekayak

10 Visitor Messages

  1. My permanent ban has been lifted(?)

    Happy new year to you and yours and enjoy whats left of this year.

    Regards John
  2. Thanks for that BKR,off forum I am a much more amicable person who is genuinely interested in learning.
    Some of my sources appear authoritive(like Royce Gracie's mouth in the documentry,who would have thought he was lying for the whole community to see).
    Other sources are and some are not
    Thanks for the we bit of history on that.
  3. BJJ is not from koryu or any other form of japanese jujutsu, it is derived from Judo, with add ons from other styles of grappling (wrestling, sambo itself a derivitive of Judo, catch wrestling).

    The infamous "triangle choke" was learned by the Gracies from a Judo book.
  4. Royce Gracie is full of ****. Maeda taught them Kodokan Judo as it was practiced at the time.

    It's marketing, Judo was the main competitior for BJJ when the Gracies were doing the whole UFC thing. We have had huge flame wars in the past over this, especially when BJJ was first arriving on the scene. It's all settled.
  5. Judo at one time used leg locks of various sorts in randori and shiai. Kano himself changed the rules to disallow them. That was a lot longer than 20 0r 30 years ago. Crap, I started doing Judo 30 years ago!

    The advent of leg locks in BJJ is a modern phenomena, from catch or even Sambo.
  6. Your'e just telling me stuff I've known for a long time regarding the gracies and Maeda. I'm glad you understand though.
  7. I am not a Judoka or BJJ exponent and have very limited training in traditional Jujutsu.

    My sincere appologies if my lack of knowledge offended you and thankyou for pointing
    it out for my improvement.

    Regards John
  8. This was consistant with the limited Judo and Jujutsu I was exposed to in 1985.

    The correct source would have to be Judo/jujutsu with the main influence being Kodokan Judo.

    I also never said that it descended from "koryu jujutsu" and in fact there are many non "Koryu"
    jujutsu schools/styles around today as Gezere pointed out(his example was not one of them though)
  9. CNTD

    In an interview with Royce Gracie on a documentary about UFC and the rise of Gracie Jujutsu
    (UFC:Ultimate Royce Gracie) Royce refers to the style his family learnt
    under "Conde Koma" as Jujutsu.

    This along with the fact that "modern olympic styled judo" and most modern judo styles(last 20 to 30 years)
    don't utilize legs to lock the opponet and other components of Gracie Jujutsu are not found in
    modern Judo,I concluded that the main source of this art was juijutsu.
  10. Hello BKR

    Count Combat,Conde Koma or Mitsuyo Maeda 前田 光世 practised Kodokan Judo and introduced this
    to the Gracie family.
    His art was also known at the time as 'Kano Jiu-Jitsu'-but this was more than likely a
    miss representation or misguided respect towards Mitsuyo Maeda's teacher,Kano Jigoro,who founded
    Judo and probably only used locally(South America).
    As Mitsuyo Maeda trained at the Kodokan his style was Kodokan Judo as you pointed out.
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