We've seen the ninja larpers...

What's your take on the Ren Faire Larpers?

People that dress up and bash at each other without considering about technique. I tried to explain it to them twice, but all I got was a porcupine reply and a good laugh. Alas, they still frustrate me in the long run, however.

Here's the video that got me started.

YouTube - Dane Fury (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKuctQYAum8)

I think they're trying, but in the end all they get is a good bash.

well, they're having fun playing a game. It's like rolling up on two kids wrestling in the back yard and starting to lecture them on not holding position correctly.

"That's not how you sprawl! Choke him already!" He yelled at the 4 year olds covered in mud

meh...
looks like my friends and i when we did boffer weapons and our only instruction was trial and error through pressure testing.

they're going harder then the SCA larpers.

Really? The SCA larpers i've seen banged the **** out of each other with rattan sticks. They just did it with weak technique.

Also, there's nothing wrong with Larping as long as you're doing it to Larp.

Because there are no surviving Viking Age combat manuals or treatises, any attempt to recreate Viking hand-to-hand combat is automatically speculative. It's certainly possible to "retro-fit" tactics and techniques from later, more detailed sources, combine that with information gleaned from the Icelandic sagas etc. and pressure-test the whole thing using accurate replicas of the appropriate weapons and armor, but the result would still be speculation. IMO there's nothing wrong with that as long as everyone is clear about the process.

In this case, while it looks to me as if these guys may not have done much research, they are fighting very hard with steel swords and their only armor appears to be mostly-open faced helmets, and their shields. My main concern would actually be for their physical safety, but hell, some people free-climb mountains for fun.

Here's a very different, more technical demonstration of combat with the Viking shield and sword, from the Hammaborg HEMA club in Hamburg, Germany. They have retro-fitted some of the large shield techniques shown in Talhoffer's fechtbuchen (combat treatises) and similar sources to develop a speculative Viking style.

YouTube - hammaborg talhoffer variations for viking shield and sword (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8SRaa33otU)
YouTube - hammaborg viking shield and sword I (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWSTx0tZHCU)
YouTube - hammaborg viking shield and sword II (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGNBc7ewusQ)
YouTube - hammaborg viking shield and sword III (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXPujfwQJUg)

It's kind of silly to compare renfaire LARPers to ninja LARPers because the ninja LARPers think they are doing The Real **** and the renfaire people know that they're LARPing. It's pretty much where the concept of LARP (as a hobby, not an insult) comes from in the first place.

It's kind of silly to compare renfaire LARPers to ninja LARPers because the ninja LARPers think they are doing The Real **** and the renfaire people know that they're LARPing. It's pretty much where the concept of LARP (as a hobby, not an insult) comes from in the first place.

When somebody refers to banging at each other as a "fight", it really doesn't sound like they're LARPing anymore. And judging from his answers to my slightly criticising posts, he does think he's the Real ****.

i still wouldn't compare this to ninjer larping.

just the aliveness alone would make an entire tard of ninjers **** in their jammies.

not that we use swords and shields much now a days, but they do have some good moves and would definitely be able to cut up some ninjas!

When somebody refers to banging at each other as a "fight", it really doesn't sound like they're LARPing anymore. And judging from his answers to my slightly criticising posts, he does think he's the Real ****.

Honestly, it doesn't look bad to me. The big guy is keeping himself well-covered with his shield against attacks to different targets, keeps the other fellow mostly on the defensive, then feints low, uses his own shield effectively to trap his opponent's and finishes with a logical cut-stab-slash combination. It's lively, tactical full contact fighting (except for the throat slash at the end, which is obviously playing to the crowd).

I'm not clear on what your objection is.

When somebody refers to banging at each other as a "fight", it really doesn't sound like they're LARPing anymore. And judging from his answers to my slightly criticising posts, he does think he's the Real ****.

Calling yourself The Real **** in the context of SCA and the like is mostly in the context of "I fucking made this armor myself over twenty long evenings hunched over a metalworking bench after work, someone joined me to swing pieces of steel and rattan and wood at each other, and we research 11th century military tactics before we bang hot wenches with died red hair and bosoms all up in yo' grill."

That's not the same thing as "give me money, sign this contract, act strangely cultlike and I'll show you the secret Viking death slash."

I think you're overreaching here. As Rivington said....we appropriated the term to criticize those in the martial arts. It would be kind of weird to start pillaging the actual LARPing community for...y'know...LARPing.

To me the SCA is an example of people being good at bad rules. As historical fighting, it fails. But it's a fun sport fight.

, and we research 11th century military tactics before we bang FAT wenches with died red hair and bosoms all up in yo' grill."

.

Fixed your typo

Fixed your typo

HAHAHAHA...Guilty.

Honestly, it doesn't look bad to me. The big guy is keeping himself well-covered with his shield against attacks to different targets, keeps the other fellow mostly on the defensive, then feints low, uses his own shield effectively to trap his opponent's and finishes with a logical cut-stab-slash combination. It's lively, tactical full contact fighting (except for the throat slash at the end, which is obviously playing to the crowd).

I'm not clear on what your objection is.

My objection is that he has awful footwork, attacks only with a high and a low diagonal without any actual momentum (he just casually swings the weapon), he hits him with a glancing blow on the head (the only protected area he has) and the other guy falls so he can get on with the show. There are no leg shots, which are the prime targets against leg users, especially when using viking shields, the cuts are off-target and aiming at the shield just for the swashbuckling effect. The shield trapping was nice, but it felt more like the other guy just extended his shield for that to happen- the loser didn't even actively try to use it (not to mention that the first "charging" cut wouldn't even have hit on target and yet the other guy felt obliged to raise his sword just so the other blade could hit somewhere). These are my issues, technique-wise. But I've seen far, far worse.

My real problem (and hence the reference to LARPing) is that when I tried pointing them out, in a neutral manner (not even in a pure bullshido way, alas), it seems I triggered a defensive reflex (you can check out earlier posts, they're really funny). These guys claim to do LIVE STEEL COMBAT (yes, caps were copied from the original) and after all, as they say, "either way works for us vikings. ", and as a serious practicioner of WMA, this simply hits the bullshit meter. Imagine practicing e.g. muai thai, and these guys post a crappy video of a play fight and claim they're OMG TRAINING FOR TEH BLOOD PITS. Which is why I posted it here in the first place, wondering if any of you guys have ever encountered crap like that.