You don't...get it...They never did....It's still in the field manual, which no one has, no one uses, and no one has time for.
This is a 2ID policy being extended to 8th army. These are decisions made by some DivCom who gets a dumb idea that no one tells him is dumb.
Do you seriously think they have like a lab in which they perform tests to determine what is best?
Yeah, Wastrel...that's exactly what I thought.
****, I'm not that stupid, contrary to what you might believe. I have a pretty good idea how that works.
What I was asking was why the military, or certain units in the military, see fit to **** around with or scrap stuff that works and at the same time, introduce systems and **** that doesn't work.
That's all I wanted to know.
I don't know too much about the US Military...well, the parts we're discussing anyway. Wastrel, you said all this stuff is still in the field manual. Any chance this is one I could find in one of those surplus stores, or one of those sites that sells military training stuff? Might be worth reading.
Gotta save this thread for the next time somebody brings up the "My style was used to train U.S. soldiers so you KNOW it's practical!" argument . . .
It does seem a little counterproductive for the army to incorporate TKD, and making it mandatory at that. The flashy kicks that TKD is well known for have no place on the battle field, much less in general combat. What was mentioned before in previous posts is true; those kicks just can't be succesfully executed wearing heavy gear. Good, non-mcDojo TKD schools teach self defense, and make a clear distinction between the sport and real combat. For the military, the sport aspect of TKD just doesn't have an actual purpose. The self defense/real combat area of TKD has some good things, but it would not be as near as comprehensive as taking a more MMA approach.
Wow. My first post became an article!
THIS program is what the Army ought to mirror; but they won't due to service rivalries no doubt.
and many more links you can find with simple searching.
Any soldier would probably realize dirty boxing and lowround/push kicks, and just wrestling and judo would be his best bet... oh, and how to use weapons and improvise them. Thats generally what works anywhere in the world, in any venue, except in sparring with BS rules. That also means OMG MMA IN A REAL FIGHT OH NOES ITS TEH SPORT ART!
Hopefully they won't have to follow BS from some bigheaded "grand mastah" with a 18 stripe black belt. Or, hopefully someone with a temper would prove otherwise. I'm just amazed there isn't anyone with a BRAIN who canned it yet. Jesus ****.
At least it will goad our enemies into thinking we're either weak, or amazingly strong if they are just as ignorant regarding HtH. So its not too bad, its not like anyone is retarded enough to use this crap.
I hope all this will amount to is an annoyance to some poor soldiers and something that pissed us off, nothing more.
I agree with Wastel about no TKD hope. I know a student studying abroad from South Korea, and he says TKD is basically a business and nothing more over there. Essentially there is a similar attitude here.
i've met quiet a few exchange students here at my uni that come from korea when they come to our tkd club. and they're not any better than the wtf guys i've met. they've got just as many mcdojos over there as here if not more, at least here the mcdojo syndrome is spread around various arts, there, it's all tkd. we had one guy that was amazing, but he was an old schooler.
i honestly can't see this being good for tkd.
Yeah, can you imagine how many GI's are going to come home to open schools?
I G0tz da l337 ArmiE TKDD!!!
Now this makes me physically ill.
I'm so glad that I wasn't in the 2nd ID and now I'm even more glad that I'm not in the Army anymore. How profane is this crap.
Personally, I think the guy who suggested this is a Jack Ass that should be jettisoned into the cold, cold depths of outer space.
Originally posted by Nihilanthic
Any soldier would probably realize dirty boxing and lowround/push kicks, and just wrestling and judo would be his best bet... oh, and how to use weapons and improvise them.
I wouldn't count on a great deal of the Privates realizing any such thing or for that matter very many of the NCO's. In fact, you wouldn't believe how many guys told me that they were studying Ninjitsu, or some equally unlikely MA back home in Nebraska, Alaska, Texas, etc...
Or time a Navy Seal told me to stand "catty corner" to effectively defend myself. I tried to tell him why I felt differently; boy did he get indignant.
TKD in Korea is fascinating. Yesterday's paper carried the article that started this thread and today's paper has a report that Kim Un Yong (politician, former head of the KTA, current player in the IOC, and all around suspect individual) and his number one crony, are *finally* being investigated for corruption. They are accused of various financial improprieties as well as using "TKD Thugs" to block votes in the KTA and other venues.
The average person's experience with TKD in Korea is pay yer dues, come to class, obey the master, get your belt. The military is not much better. Perhaps Wastrel would know better than me, but I believe the standard RoK soldier gets a three month black belt in TKD. Some sections of the army train differently - more or less time, more or less practice.
Special forces use, or are reported to use at any rate, Tuk Gong Mu Sool. It's quite aggressive and combines a lot of the locking and displacement principles of HKD with the kickboxing sparring skills of Gyok Too Gi (Korean "streetfighting"/MT). They do a lot of conditioning, have stripped formal confucian rank issues from the progression, and wear shoes and regular gear to class. This, I like.
When I read about 2ID participating in TKD training, my first reaction was not about combat. It was that this was a ploy to help mend some of the rampant anti-americanism here. I live in Seoul now, but I spent three years (97-2000) living in Uijeongbu (not far from Red Cloud) and I can tell you that no matter how mean it was during the currency crisis in 98, it is much more hostile now. I go there every weekend and the riot cops have basically taken up residency on the streets leading from Uijeongbu station.
This may be more social than anything else.
Got a Korean pal who holds officer rank in S.K. army and he's a 4th degree now, I think. Anyway..while he's a cool guy outside of a dojang, he can turn to a completely hard head when he's in class. he invited me to spar one time and since i could use the knocks, I was up for it. However, there is an obvious difference in the way we spar: I tend to PUNCH and not just kick. After being whacked in the stomach and head few times, he stopped me and said I was not "TKD sparring " and what I was doing was not the "Oriental way". I found that statement rather odd..but I followed his rule and we did the riverdancing olympic style. He then asked me to stop blocking with my shin. When it boiled down to it, it sounded like he just wanted a human kicking bag. Turns out he was a sports guy, even though he kept telling me he was taught Combat TKD...
Two statements he said still ring in my head as weird..
"You fight good for fight, but not sport" Wouldn't that be a good thing) and "No, NO, you punching..this not boxing..this TKD, this the oriental way"(what the hell is the oriental way..i'm half asian..I'd like to know)
Anybody else ever encounter something like that?:rolleyes: