Koshiki no Kata is an interesting kata originating from Kito ryu. Kano loaned it to Kodokan but it is not an official kata required for Dan Gradings in judo. Is it included in the curriculum of any jujutsu school/organisation?

Description? youtube link? I am not familar with Kito-ryu kata.

Koshiki no Kata is an interesting kata originating from Kito ryu. Kano loaned it to Kodokan but it is not an official kata required for Dan Gradings in judo. Is it included in the curriculum of any jujutsu school/organisation?Wrong. 8th dans are required to know Koshiki no kata, btw. It is part of the Kodokan curriculum, and it was not loaned to the Kodokan by Kano. Kano incorporated this kata into the Kodokan curriculum as a means to preserve the techniques from Kito Ryu that he felt were compatible to Judo.

Plazma, some youtube treats for ya.

The man demonstrating the Kata

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4ggqaoLR7A

Longer performances

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3xFGrWXZjs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwLK1dy9GwM

Also, according to wiki


Some striking demonstrations of it from the 1950s can be seen in the film "Classic Judo Kata," by Hal Sharp. If the description of the kata in that film is correct, it would be the only judo kata that involves attacking the cervical spine---certainly no other judo kata includes that technique.

Thanks Macho.

I'm not really a kata person, but I've been try to find video of this kata performed in the traditional armor. This is the only one I could find.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrjd_BjAtaA

I'm not really a kata person, but I've been try to find video of this kata performed in the traditional armor. This is the only one I could find.

Yeah, I remember seeing that too. I guess it's...kind of like real armor? Maybe? (Then again, for all I know, that could be uber-authentic. It just looks like tin foil.)

weird stuff. looks more like aikido for robots than judo.

how do the techniques in the kata relate to the rest of the judo curriculum?

From what I know about Judo, not much

weird stuff. looks more like aikido for robots than judo.The yt history has lots of people questioning the autenticity of this. Props to them for trying to try it with armor, but notice the differences between that clip and the previous one done in a Judo setting, as a Judo kata examination.


how do the techniques in the kata relate to the rest of the judo curriculum?Not directly, at least not to the more "basal" katas. Seems to me it's more a vehicle for historical preservation, which is a good think considering how much information has been lost in JJ before on/from the time Judo was being formulated.

Remember that Judo also has a mandatory educational and historical aspect to it, mandatory to higher level practitioners that is. At least that's how it seems given that this Kata is a requirement for pple pursuing an 8th dan.

weird stuff. looks more like aikido for robots than judo.

how do the techniques in the kata relate to the rest of the judo curriculum?

Katas are learning/training tools. I find Nage no kata very useful, the rest not so much, and generally the opinions vary. There are people, especially from Europe, that went on to win Worlds without bothering much with kata, and there are World and All Japan champions that consider kata crucial part of Judo.

As for Koshiki and Itsutsu, Kano added these to the Judo curriculum quite late in his life when his focus was not so much the combat aspect but rather the health/education aspect of Judo. Very few regular Judo practicioners and competitors get to learn these within their prime competitive shiai carriers.

Ask this question on Judoforum.com, there's a couple of old time senseis there that will explain this better than I can.

Tomas

Judo has katas? WTF?

True test of a Judo black belt if they got it for hitting the books or hitting the mat. Ask them how many katas they know if the laugh and say I did one for my black belt then you know they competed. If they give you a long diatribe
about the benefits and how they are perfecting the finer points then you know they hardly compete.

Before anyone jumps in to defend kata in Judo. I understand the the uses and benefits. I also understand why its needed. I know 3 katas and suck ass at all three. Katame no kata was called "pedestrian at best" when I tested for my nidan. Personally I want my guys to be well rounded in Judo and know all of it. I am just not going to kill myself correcting kata instead of spending my time doing uchi komi, nage komi and randori.

I absolutely agree with you. I find Nage no kata useful. Had to do it for my shodan and I think I picked up stuff that I otherwise wouldn't bother with (like left uchimata...). I did Katame no kata (uke part) and I find it pretty redundant if one spends reasonable amount of time doing real newaza.

Koshiki and Itsutsu are really esotheric.

Tomas


Judo has katas? WTF?

True test of a Judo black belt if they got it for hitting the books or hitting the mat. Ask them how many katas they know if the laugh and say I did one for my black belt then you know they competed. If they give you a long diatribe
about the benefits and how they are perfecting the finer points then you know they hardly compete.

Before anyone jumps in to defend kata in Judo. I understand the the uses and benefits. I also understand why its needed. I know 3 katas and suck ass at all three. Katame no kata was called "pedestrian at best" when I tested for my nidan. Personally I want my guys to be well rounded in Judo and know all of it. I am just not going to kill myself correcting kata instead of spending my time doing uchi komi, nage komi and randori.