Slider, back to your original post and the video. I think you've already gotten a lot of good feedback, but one thing I noticed that I'm not sure if anyone has commented on is that you kept ending up off ballance because you were over extending your technique. This is a common reaction to fighting someone who retreats a lot, i.e. they retreat while you art throwing the technique so you try and extend it out further and end up off ballance becuase you have extended your center far forward of your base. Rather than trying to land the kick, or even extend it, once your opponent start to retreat, use the technique as a step into another attack. Repeat as necessary. If he keeps retreating, he'll end up running out of the ring and you won't have had to waste the energy throwing a technique, just chambering for techniques while chasing him out of the ring. The most important thing is to keep your center over your your base so that you can transition quickly from one technique into the next. If you over extend, you spend a lot of time and energy getting your ballance back, which slows down your follow on attacks and leaves you wide open to a counter attack.

it sounds like shitty judges to me.

If you think about it, the rules for WTF fighting are really not that different from KK. FC kicks to body and head, and FC punches to body. Which means the main problem with WTF fighting is the emphasis and execution of those rules. In other words, the judging.

The excessive safety gear doesn't help either, but I digress...

I think you are confusing punching with fisting.

Knowing Der, I'm guessing he was actually thinking of a donkey punch.

If you think about it, the rules for WTF fighting are really not that different from KK. FC kicks to body and head, and FC punches to body. Which means the main problem with WTF fighting is the emphasis and execution of those rules. In other words, the judging.

The excessive safety gear doesn't help either, but I digress...
I almost entirely agree, but I would put the emphasis 50-50 on the gear and the judging. That body armor makes a big difference.

I agree, the "body armor," as you call it, makes a difference, but not quite 50/50. Believe me, it's really not THAT much protection; the effect is mainly psychological. It doesn't take too much talent to really rock somebody if that's what your goal is, even through the hogu. I'm going to shift blame a bit here, less on the armor, more on the judging, and perhaps more on training and attitude at most WTF schools I've seen/heard of (though my opinion may be biased b/c of limited information, and never actually having attended a proper one). The shitty judging is a product of the attitude of schools, and some schools want to emphasize kicks, but it seems they really don't teach the kicks well, so kids don't use them, so they penalize reliance on punching, tho it's viable by wtf rules (if you're good enuogh at it). Just a theory.
Another huge problem is the "kick for the point, but control and don't hurt" mentality used to keep kids who would shy away from a more physical philosophy. It's dumb, but it pays the bills and then some. Also, it's way easier to make ppl think they can kick well if they don't kick evasive targets hard. Think about it: how often do you actually hurt your foot, shin or ankle on a bag, vs on a moving target with really hard bits all over? Low power kicking is a commercial dream come true.
Here's where it becomes pertinent to Mav's post (finally, I know... stfu and read the happy goodness!): this low power kicking means people are just going strictly by points, and instructors (of that caliber) "know" that punches aren't scoreworthy, so they discourage them, and this carries over into judging and reffing. What's more is that hard kicks are seen as "uncontrolled" and "dangerous," so they're not taught and discouraged, which, as any of you know, drastically changes how the game is played.
I blame the tourneys, and the mentality so prevalant in mcdojangs that was the reason they were run that way. Gear has an impact, but I don't think it's so much when you're going full blast, aiming to hurt.

GDIOrca91....good post.

I agree, the "body armor," as you call it, makes a difference, but not quite 50/50. Believe me, it's really not THAT much protection;
It's not just about protection. The gear has a greater influence on the sport than just as body armor.

I'm with Mav on this one too. If you can find me any videos of a fighter getting hurt through the hogu I'd be interested in seeing it. It's not so much to do with how much padding they have, it's the way they disperse the force of impact, combined with the fact that they're on a target that's able to move with and ride the impact. It makes linear penetrating kicks like a regular side kick almost void.

Slider, back to your original post and the video. I think you've already gotten a lot of good feedback, but one thing I noticed that I'm not sure if anyone has commented on is that you kept ending up off ballance because you were over extending your technique. This is a common reaction to fighting someone who retreats a lot, i.e. they retreat while you art throwing the technique so you try and extend it out further and end up off ballance becuase you have extended your center far forward of your base. Rather than trying to land the kick, or even extend it, once your opponent start to retreat, use the technique as a step into another attack. Repeat as necessary. If he keeps retreating, he'll end up running out of the ring and you won't have had to waste the energy throwing a technique, just chambering for techniques while chasing him out of the ring. The most important thing is to keep your center over your your base so that you can transition quickly from one technique into the next. If you over extend, you spend a lot of time and energy getting your ballance back, which slows down your follow on attacks and leaves you wide open to a counter attack.

That's a pretty fair assessment as well... though I think this is being improved upon. You should see my earlier videos... they are worse (if you can imagine that). But you are right... Im definatly not where I should be.

Though... this leads ito the whole charging thing I'm getting **** about as well... though I suppose if you're faking kicks it's not so bad?

Yeah... the hogu makes a huge difference. You don't have to be so careful. It provides a shitload of protection in my opinion. Remove it and I think even with the same kick first training mentality you change the game...

That's a pretty fair assessment as well... though I think this is being improved upon. You should see my earlier videos... they are worse (if you can imagine that). But you are right... Im definatly not where I should be.

Though... this leads ito the whole charging thing I'm getting **** about as well... though I suppose if you're faking kicks it's not so bad?

Not so much faking, although you can and should throw feints in as well, but changing your attack if its obvious the guy is retreating faster than you can hit him with the initial kick without overextending yourself. I used to strongly discourage feints in my lower level students (I got this from my original instructor), telling them to throw every kick like they meant it, but to not follow through on the technigue if it was obvious it was going to miss. This is a much harder skill to learn than feinting, and once you get it down, it makes your feints much more convincing and ultimately your opponent should have a hard time differentiating between a feint and an aborted/redirected technique.

For example, say I'm throwing a skipping roundhouse and the guy retreats back out of range as my knee is coming up. Rather than waste the time and energy to extend my kick and roll my hip over, I decide to either turn the kick into a double kick and try and get him with my back leg, or if he has stepped back even further, turn the first kick into a forward step going into a back kick.

Another strategy to use with someone who retreats a lot like that guy (i.e. straight back as fast as he can as soon as you start to initiate any offensive move) is to try and anticipate where he is going to end up in his retreat and aim your kicks their. This will reguire a lot more of an aggressive hop or step to initiate the attack and if he's smart he'll adjust quickly after you nail him a couple of times, but at least it will punish him for being a *****.

You know, score or not, I would throw punches just to keep the pressure on. Here are a couple of tips from a white belt.

- Move around:
Don't charge in with your turning kicks, you two look like pissed off penguins flapping your arms and feet, bouncing off each other. (Oh that was mean. but the imagery was just to good.) get around his kicks, keep the distance. Never let them just kick you. When I started I just blocked everything. I find moving around, less exhausting, and more opportune

- Hands:
Not only keep your guard up, use them, move them around, make your opponent look at them, then bam kick to the HEAD. Then follow with some punches, score or not, then BAM to the head when he is off balance, then help him up. (If they start scoring on you more, see point above. Or like, block.)

- follow through.
We are a friendly people, but we are tougher than you'd think. I personally like getting the wind knocked out of me. This will keep the blows cleaner. You guys are kicking each other, and neither seem to notice. If you hit harder, he wouldn't kick back so easily.

Anyways, what I have said is only from my limited knowledge of a different style of Taekwon-Do. I'd love to see more videos from you. More so, I would love to see a WTF guy actually implement some of the tips they ask for, instead of just get defensive. I hate to be so critical, these are just things that are drilled into us right from our first class. As they were probably in yours.

Peace and TAEKWON!

I think you are confusing punching with fisting.

The name of the technique is 驢拳/려권.

It's pronounced Ryeogwon.

The name of the technique is 驢拳/려권.

It's pronounced Ryeogwon.

Hard to read the first hanja, is that 려 as in 나귀?

You know, score or not, I would throw punches just to keep the pressure on. Here are a couple of tips from a white belt.



A WHITE belt?
Wait six weeks until you are a BLACK belt and then give advice.

:5bouncy:

I could buy one if you think it will give my points any more validation.