We disagree about what this site is supposed to be about
Read my post, I didnt disagree, I said you might be right!


Though arguably tenets could fall under MABS
Only if one considers them BS in the first place to warrent posting it there. Im not saying they are or not, but in the style forum this can be discussed and STILL pointed out if that is the case.




That's the freaking point. Keeping this sort of thing in insular and flame retardant forums is ridiculous.
And as I pointed out, you are making a case about something that hasnt happened. Maybe you been watching to much Tom Cruise in Minority Report :icon_bigg


On the technical and historical ends of things, style specific forums add nothing.
If you say so! Seems others disagree including whomever had the original idea of setting them up and getting Bullshido to impliment them. Funnily enough the info says "This forum is for all current practitioners and those with ties to the KMA community.".. perhaps you dont feel wanted enough... of course not, theres plenty of other places for you, like the rest of the forums!



I really think you'd be better off at MAP.
Awww...



More well rounded does not mean "shield from criticism and wrap in a korean flag". If you can't defend aspects of your style from criticism the problem is with your style or your understanding of your style, not bullshido.
Well so far Ive seen no "Korean flag wrapping". And aspects can be discussed, critised and defended on there, its just done by people that know what they are talking about (as it pertains to their system) or even those that are willing to listen rather than ignore the bits they dont want to hear or dont agree with!



1) Technical forums are already moderated pretty heavily.
Ill take your word for it


2) The problem is that many (and I suspect you're included in this) consider criticism flaming. As such this site is absolutely about flaming.
Nope.. I can distingish from flaming and criticism. And I thought this iste was about martial arts and a dose of reality.. thanks for enlightening me.


Anyway, at this point we're shitting up the thread (further).
At last I think we agree on something.


If you're so inclined feel free to start a new thread about style forums. If so, start with giving a concrete example about what, while considering the mission statement of this site, specific style forums add.
Well Im not inclined because
1. I didnt ask for them to be started
2. I didnt set them up either
3. I just agreed that I thought they were a decent idea so why would I need to give concrete examples about them... go speak to who ever idea it was in the first place and perhaps Bullshido managment if they grieve you so much.

The OP asked for opinions, I agree with something I read and offered some more (as thats what they wanted) and for some reason you felt ya had to jump on it


Stuart

Oh, before I go, Ill just correct post #206 (your reply to emboesso).

You: I would argue that the thread your discussing is actually an example of what is both good and bad about bullshido.
Good: Relevant discussion of the book.
In a roundabout way but brought up by someone claiming it was BS despite never having even seen a copy. Hence emboesso comments

You: Bad: Insular protection of someone after they make flawed assertions
You mean others pointing things out to you that you chose to ignore over and over. People who actually read the book or know me! You call it insular protection, I call it them telling you facts you ignored. Hence emboesso comments

You: Good: Other members calling out the inconsistency (myself and askari)
And again, either people setting you straight or saying things you didnt agree with so in your opinion were still wrong. Hence emboesso comments

You: Bad: Percieved persucution
Nope.. just facts falling on deaf ears. Hence emboesso comments

You: On that thread the grappling discussion started based on comments by the book's author and because of images used in the book. Both Askari and myself restricted our discussion to those points.
How could you discuss images used in the book that you nor the OP had seen!!! Fact is, you made your own assertions. Ignoring the facts by someone who had read the book. Hence emboesso comments

You: All the TKD-proponents got indignant even though the book's author was apparently unqualified to make the assertions he did and, regardless of qualifications, flat out incorrect.
As those that actually know a bit about TKD pointed out to you (the parts you chose to ignore) it was in fact your ascertains that were incorrect as I am qualified and it was simply your opinion again, based on what you feel rather than what is fact. Again you misrepresnt the facts as it was a TKD-proponent that started the thread in the first place and other TKD-proponents agreed with his false assertions until they became convinced otherwise - so thats hardly ALL. I believe you refer to the ones that didnt agree with you and tried (in vain) to set you straight. Hence emboesso comments

You: Because bullshido has members from lots of different skill backgrounds the nonsense the author did spout could be and was brought up. That is what the site is about.
And funnily enough, with the exception of you, despite initial misconceptions brought up by the OP who hadnt read the book, the thread found it wasnt nonsense at all.. perhaps you should go reread the thread before trying to suggest otherwise.

Hence emboesso comments :blob5:

Cut and paste your comments, which I disagree with pretty heavily with, to the thread talking about the book. And you should try rereading aspects of the thread aswell.

Cut and paste your comments, which I disagree with pretty heavily with, to the thread talking about the book.
Go do it yourself.. dam your lazy, thats the 2nd time you`ve asked me to do stuff for you! However, dont forget to remove your dark classes and ear plugs before carrying on.
And of course you disagree.. thats what you do!


And you should try rereading aspects of the thread aswell.
Why.. the thread reached a natural conclusion that left you on your own (as pointed out),. its just that you conviently missed those points!

But hey, I now understand your pain (http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=36074) but I dont hold grudges, Ill even help you with that sleeve choke problem if you like :toothy12:

I have to say I agree with Upa. Style forums are already relatively heavily moderated. As I understand it, this site is about effective fighting with empirical evidence to back it up. Logical criticism is actively encouraged. As long as the criticism is logical and every style and poster is subject to the same criteria, that's the way it should stay.

If you're more interested in other aspects of martial arts, you're probably better off either sticking to the comedy forums or not posting here at all.

In my opinion, Bullshido typically does a good job of debunking genuine cases of martial arts fraud and pseudoscience. Perhaps the real problem is that there are only so many Ashida Kims and Yellow Bamboos out there to be exposed, which leaves Bullshido (as a community) with an awful lot of time and energy on its hands. When that time and energy is spent attacking anything that doesn't closely resemble the Bullshido majority view of "what rocks", the site's credibility and reputation can suffer by default.

Just to throw this out as an example (not a great one, but an example nonetheless)...

Go do it yourself.. dam your lazy, thats the 2nd time you`ve asked me to do stuff for you!
That sentence is indicative of Bullshidoka Argument #14.

No idea what I'm talking about? Read this thread:
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=52223

Please note that I mean JUST that sentence and not anything about the argument going on - I haven't been paying attention to that part.

Just to throw this out as an example (not a great one, but an example nonetheless)...

That sentence is indicative of Bullshidoka Argument #14.

No idea what I'm talking about? Read this thread:
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=52223

Please note that I mean JUST that sentence and not anything about the argument going on - I haven't been paying attention to that part.

Not at all. Im happy for him if he wants to continue things on the thread he states, Im just not gonna do his joey work for him (the cut & paste bit)! The research (as mentioned in #14) has been done and discussed, theres nothing new to add I believe, he just wants to justify his comments here, that I rebuked (as they were on the thread by others).. on there! But it could be a waste of time as he missed them all (!!) first time around anyway!

Stuart

Stuart, I'm just talking about the wording of that sentence, honestly. I thought I explained that - the wording popped out at me a little, so I grabbed it to make a point. Yes, I admittedly took it slightly out of context to do so (by ignoring everything but the wording). I apologize if that wasn't clear.

It was also a rather unsubtle way to steer people toward that thread so they can provide their input.

Stuart, I'm just talking about the wording of that sentence, honestly. I thought I explained that - the wording popped out at me a little, so I grabbed it to make a point. Yes, I admittedly took it slightly out of context to do so (by ignoring everything but the wording). I apologize if that wasn't clear.

It was also a rather unsubtle way to steer people toward that thread so they can provide their input.

Okay, sorry. just seems if someone just read that post (without the rest) it may of seemed like I was saying to him what #14 implied, rather than just some cut & paste work (cos Im not his lacky)

Stuart

Could you detail why you think not knowing when or where **** tangents from MABS went is a problem not just for you, but for the site in general?


(Tom is now waiting intently pressing *REFRESH* *REFRESH* *REFRESH* *REFRESH* *REFRESH* ...)

Because if an investigation is in progress and the subject of the investigation or one of the subjects minions visits and posts on the thread, and posts stupid trollish garbage, and that garbage gets deleted, or moved to a place where no one knows it went there, then that person can use our "Censorship" as a crutch against the investigation. They can also claim that they were making valid, legitimate defenses to our accusations and we deleted them out of spite. If we have then quarantined in a different, but linked thread we can EASILY point to that thread and say, " No, you posted drivel, anyone can go here and read your drivel." To me any investigation should seek to preserve evidence like that, but in a way that doesn't interfere with the meat of the topic. The persons internet wankery may not reflect directly on their martial prowess, but it certainly is representative of their attitude. And while it may not be helpful to include it in the main thread where evidence is being compiled it would be advised, in my opinion, to have that wankery in a location that is easy to display should the need arrise.

Because if an investigation is in progress and the subject of the investigation or one of the subjects minions visits and posts on the thread, and posts stupid trollish garbage, and that garbage gets deleted, or moved to a place where no one knows it went there, then that person can use our "Censorship" as a crutch against the investigation. They can also claim that they were making valid, legitimate defenses to our accusations and we deleted them out of spite. If we have then quarantined in a different, but linked thread we can EASILY point to that thread and say, " No, you posted drivel, anyone can go here and read your drivel." To me any investigation should seek to preserve evidence like that, but in a way that doesn't interfere with the meat of the topic. The persons internet wankery may not reflect directly on their martial prowess, but it certainly is representative of their attitude. And while it may not be helpful to include it in the main thread where evidence is being compiled it would be advised, in my opinion, to have that wankery in a location that is easy to display should the need arrise.

First, I cannot imagine any posts like the ones you use in your example will be moved out of such a thread. (If they are, then I personally will report them and the mods will decide whether to put them back. Care to guess what position I'll take on this, should it happen?)

Second, there is nothing stopping anyone from continuing the tangents wherever they might be moved. You never know, something within such a tangent may eventually be moved back depending on what develops from it - though I doubt it: Look at what has already been moved as an example.

Third, dickheads like what you use in your example that will claim anything. Nothing whatsoever done or not done will stop that. In their minds, they already have all the justification they need to claim everything you suggest no matter what is culled or left in.

Fourth, if the need ever arises, any and all posts can already be referred to wherever they may end up. Actually, splitting off each tangent would make this easier than sifting through a mega-thread catchall. Your concern over "preservation", though valid is unjustified given what is already in place and used for just such a purpose.

And, lastly (but not leastly), let me say it again since you missed it:

No posts are to be deleted.

I dunno if this be the place, so smack me if I'm wrong, but I noticed today that changes have been made already, like the layout/background/etc of Trollshido. Nice, and thanks.


Now, isn't there a few pages of argument in this thread needs to be moved there? :-P

Hi Bladesinger:

At one point in the thread you asked why the wiki on Org is only open to supporting members at the time. The answer is that presently we believe that this group will submit articles in good faith as verses if we allowed everyone to edit which could result in some vandalism and some very partisan articles done by supporters of a particular martial arts master. For example imagine if the supporters of Angela Blanca (see thread in this section) had been able to write the article on FMA "Every master study under him, they lie about it later!"

that being said this approach limits or Org article talent pool so we'll have to fine tune this policy over time.

Not at all. Im happy for him if he wants to continue things on the thread he states, Im just not gonna do his joey work for him (the cut & paste bit)! The research (as mentioned in #14) has been done and discussed, theres nothing new to add I believe, he just wants to justify his comments here, that I rebuked (as they were on the thread by others).. on there! But it could be a waste of time as he missed them all (!!) first time around anyway!

Stuart

You're going to do his "joey" work for him if you want your comments addressed. If you want to talk about your book anymore, do it a different thread. This thread's about suggestions for the site, and I don't see where arguing over your book is anything but a total derail for this thread. (although I'd love to see the issue discussed more). It's plainly not germaine to the topic of the thread and thus belongs in one of many where it would be more appropriate.

Take a hint, unbunch your shoulders, and post about it in the right thread instead of making being asked to do so some sort of authority challenge.

Upa, it would be appreciated if you'd help him be good by assisting with the issue's confinement. Getting all the disccusion in one place will give you more room to work, after all.

By the way, all of you, once again, please feel reminded the staff has limited power over the minds of the other posters - "I feel everyone jumped all over me because I didn't do the 'right' martial art" or "I posted a thread and didn't get the response I wanted" or "I was posted about in a thread and don't know how to cope with the emotions engendered by said mention" are 'suggestion themes' we aren't really able to consider unless you have some specific notion of how you'd like that sentiment enforced within the membership - you tell us how you feel we should make people agree with/like/say only good about you and we'll take a look, together, at the workability of doing so, although the answer is very likely to be "apply some of Dr. Dennis Leary's Skin Thickening Cream"

Hi Bladesinger:

At one point in the thread you asked why the wiki on Org is only open to supporting members at the time. The answer is that presently we believe that this group will submit articles in good faith as verses if we allowed everyone to edit which could result in some vandalism and some very partisan articles done by supporters of a particular martial arts master. For example imagine if the supporters of Angela Blanca (see thread in this section) had been able to write the article on FMA "Every master study under him, they lie about it later!"

that being said this approach limits or Org article talent pool so we'll have to fine tune this policy over time.


Ahh, why thank you. Clears up quite a bit, and makes a lot more sense.

Because if an investigation is in progress and the subject of the investigation or one of the subjects minions visits and posts on the thread, and posts stupid trollish garbage, and that garbage gets deleted, or moved to a place where no one knows it went there, then that person can use our "Censorship" as a crutch against the investigation. They can also claim that they were making valid, legitimate defenses to our accusations and we deleted them out of spite. If we have then quarantined in a different, but linked thread we can EASILY point to that thread and say, " No, you posted drivel, anyone can go here and read your drivel." To me any investigation should seek to preserve evidence like that, but in a way that doesn't interfere with the meat of the topic. The persons internet wankery may not reflect directly on their martial prowess, but it certainly is representative of their attitude. And while it may not be helpful to include it in the main thread where evidence is being compiled it would be advised, in my opinion, to have that wankery in a location that is easy to display should the need arrise.

If we don't move the threads, the same people will say the investigation is unfocused and juevenile, because of all the extra stuff in the thread, or confusing because of all the links to 'silly crap.' Leaving the link up, to me, is a viable option - but depends on things like how pertinent the deraillment was and if it can stand on its own as a thread.

As far as their 'claims' about deletions, people claim we delete things every day. People have gone so far as to claim we logged in as them and manufactured the content we cracked down on them for ourselves. It's not true, but people claim it. People are going to claim things like that no matter what. The incohate ramblings of people threatened by what we do here will not be taken seriously unless presented seriously.

Go do it yourself.. dam your lazy, thats the 2nd time you`ve asked me to do stuff for you! However, dont forget to remove your dark classes and ear plugs before carrying on.
And of course you disagree.. thats what you do!


Why.. the thread reached a natural conclusion that left you on your own (as pointed out),. its just that you conviently missed those points!

But hey, I now understand your pain (http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=36074) but I dont hold grudges, Ill even help you with that sleeve choke problem if you like :toothy12:



Christ you're a passive aggressive twit. Since you seem interested in continuing the conversation about your qualifications, or not, to instruct grappling, you post your comments in the appropriate venue. Never mind, I'll do it for you tomorrow and address them then.

On the topic of this thread, improving bullshido, can the alternation of type color be considered a punishable offense? It seems like this is only done without intentional campiness by schmucks.