I was more wondering about the differences in the system, why 12 in one and 10 in another? Was it lineage, location? Also, how do the animals apply in light of what I have heard about the energies in Xing Yi I believe splitting is one? If there are links with this info I would appreciate them if you don't feel like typing it out.

Gotcha. I have to be honest, I dont know why one has 10 and the other has 12. By the same token, even umong the systems of XY the animals are not the same. Ours are :
Dragon, Tiger, Monkey, Horse, Turtle, Chicken, Phoenix, Sparrow, Snake, Bear/Eagle, Chicken.

I do not have martial art history as an interest so there are others that could answer the "Why"question MUCH better than I could.

The animals apply to the "energies", some by combining the elements, other by refining one, still others by providing training in skills that either the elements dont cover or compliment them.

For example, if you take Dragon, I would argue that Dragon's primary purpose is to train the rising and falling of the body. If I had to pin that to an element, it would be Metal or Splitting.

However, I dont think that you can put the animals in easy categories of Dragon = Splitting, Horse = Pounding. Most of the animals combine various elements.

I was looking in the technical discussion forum and there were some youtube videos that helped out immensely as far as getting an idea of what is meant by the 5 fists. Sorry I bothered you all by not just looking there first.

Gotcha. I have to be honest, I dont know why one has 10 and the other has 12. By the same token, even umong the systems of XY the animals are not the same. Ours are :
Dragon, Tiger, Monkey, Horse, Turtle, Chicken, Phoenix, Sparrow, Snake, Bear/Eagle, Chicken.

I do not have martial art history as an interest so there are others that could answer the "Why"question MUCH better than I could.

The animals apply to the "energies", some by combining the elements, other by refining one, still others by providing training in skills that either the elements dont cover or compliment them.

For example, if you take Dragon, I would argue that Dragon's primary purpose is to train the rising and falling of the body. If I had to pin that to an element, it would be Metal or Splitting.

However, I dont think that you can put the animals in easy categories of Dragon = Splitting, Horse = Pounding. Most of the animals combine various elements.
I was told it goes back to Dai Longbang, and Old Shanxi style. The 10 animals of the even older Shanxi [original xinyi] style and the Henan style were created, according to the histories, by Ji Longfeng [Jike] and passed down to Cao Jiwu and hence, Ma Xueli, etc. Dai was researching his xinyi, and decided to add two new movements - the Tai bird (now practised as yin Tai and yang Tai, two slightly different movements), which is a strong double armed movement (the concept being: the Tai bird is a mythical bird with wings powerful enough to break an opponent with a single flap), and the Tuo, which is often thought to be the Yangzi river alligator. That's a more circular movement in appearance, supposed to imitate the way an alligator moves forward in mud, using a twisting of its waist and round movements of its arms. These movements were added without removing any of the original, and everyone who learnt xinyi or xingyi from any part of the Dai Longbang lineage (so, including Li Feiyu, creator of Hebei style) has the 12 rather than the 10. You are very unlikely to find someone who knows and can teach the original 10 forms in the west, I think, and most people will learn either New Shanxi or Hebei styles, and these two are in many ways the same, since Che Yizhai studied in the Hebei lineage before returning to his native Shanxi to teach (I think that's how it goes, anyway.)
As to the fist properties of the animals, I also don't think you can fit them into categories like that. They do train certain parts of internal body mechanics, though, that are suited to the fists. For instance, Tuo, as mentioned above, will train the waist well for performing good Hengquan (and others, of course), and Hu (tiger), Shuang Ma (double horse), Tai, and some parts of Yan (swallow? Never learnt this translation, I just learnt it was some kind of small bird, and I might be missing some information here) all contribute to developing the spine for all movements, but especially piquan, as they are double movements, and need the spine and not the waist for their main power structure.
Other differences in the older styles and newer styles are: the concept of the 3 clubs or 3 fists (not normally present in Hebei and New Shanxi), the different motions of the 5 fists, in particular piquan, which is an actual fist in the older styles, modified by Li Feiyu (or Luoneng, etc) to be a palm. And the differences between New Shanxi and Hebei are: different practise method. I think New Shanxi stylists stand in Santi for only about 10 minutes in each session and Hebei stylists are encouraged to stand for a much longer time, even up to a number of hours. It's these differences that make the differences between the different styles, as opposed to in, say, Changquan styles, where different movements make the distinctions. There are some minor differences in motion - more emphasis on Shuang Ma in the Ma form in New Shanxi, for instance - but the differences are about as much if not more in different sections of Hebei style.
As for the "young man xingyi, middle aged bagua, old man taiji" idea: xingyi is an excellent art for any age. There is no need to think, "well, I'm 50 now, I should be transitioning into taijiquan". I think the main reason people think that is because 1) they get bored easily, 2) taiji and bagua are more seductive in appearance, 3) they want to be like Sun Lutang and Hong Yixiang. Fact is, you are very unlikely to master all three arts. Is Xingyi practical? Yes, there is no such thing as a genuinely impractical traditional martial art, only a martial art taught poorly. Traditional martial arts would not be around today if they weren't practical, as in the old days, practitioners would simply fight each other and see which was the best school, and people could easily die in these matches, and schools would adapt or be finished. Xingyi has proven itself on the leitai (Cao Jiwu) and in battle (the Second World War), so its pedigree is pretty good. But, don't rely on the idea of it being a practical art to lure you into a poor school or poor teaching of it.
I think the main reasons to practise different arts are to do with subjective preference and lifestyle. I happen to have a small practise space and a desire to learn something health providing, traditional, and useful, with an emphasis on power, so xingyi is perfect, and I will continue to practise it throughout my life. I practise a number of bagua footwork patterns, but not circle walking, and I practise no real bagua techniques.
I'm not a fount of all xingyi knowledge, and I do not intend ever to teach anyone, except maybe some neigong for my children and some of the basics. But I hope this can answer some questions, even though I'm far from mastering this art, and probably never will.

Good to see another forum for Xingyiquan practitioners. I hope it can help people to better understand what XYQ is and what it isn't.

For those wishing to discuss in Chinese, my own forum is at http://www.xingyiquan.org/Discuz/index.php.

Good luck all.

Apparently Xing Yi is for bad guys, and Bagua is for good guys. (Jet Li's "The One")

Apparently Xing Yi is for bad guys, and Bagua is for good guys. (Jet Li's "The One")

HAHAHA True true. Evil wears the hat of Xing Yi! :)

No really, are they all supposed to be the same thing or not?

In 6 years training of Hsing I, as founded by Mike Patterson, I've never heard anyone address that there is a any more of difference than simply spelling. But in chinese martials arts that means everything, also ppl i've met from other said schools, did'nt even have the same animal forms, though the core principals were still there. So it's always been kinda like "I guess they are they same, prolly..."

Or are the other ones from different parts of china maybe, Hsing I is suppposed to be from XanXi(HsanHsi)((Shan shee?)) er Southern China basically.

Ok,ok, more importantly, which is more popular here? Or which is addressed more here?

LAstly, i guess I'll say which is better too...(not like i care)

SO FIRE AWAY!
xD

no really,

1. Diffrence?

2.Your Vote

3.Why?

TELL ME!!!!!

They are all the same thing, just romanized differently as there are several popular ways of translating chinese. Style wise all forms of Xingyi are pretty similar. I trained in Hebei style, which is what Mike Patterson teaches, for three years and then I switched to a Shanxi style school because I moved. There were some differences like the elements were done slightly differently as were the animal forms but it wasn't a lot.
The only exception would be Henan style which is a whole different animal and is commonly referred to as xingyiliuhequan. They don't have elements and there are around ten animal forms with multiple sets each.

They're just different translations; it's not like _ing _un, where there are different "lineages" associated with each transliteration.

Awesome thanks guys.

My teacher trained under Mike Patterson, he said that it was a Shanxi style.
Our system, has 5 elements, 8 "fist" forms, a kicking form, and 12 animals. At least thats what i gattered.

Is the Shanxi styles supposedly more hardcore? Well it was always my impression. I heard the northern styles were prettier with more kicks and nift. While the southern styles had more punches and were more to the point. And Shanxi being of the southern.

Is that true?

Also, has Hsing I been in the YMAS yet? I would love to see that,lol

Awesome thanks guys.

My teacher trained under Mike Patterson, he said that it was a Shanxi style.
Our system, has 5 elements, 8 "fist" forms, a kicking form, and 12 animals. At least thats what i gattered.

Is the Shanxi styles supposedly more hardcore? Well it was always my impression. I heard the northern styles were prettier with more kicks and nift. While the southern styles had more punches and were more to the point. And Shanxi being of the southern.

Is that true?That's usually the impression of people from one style to the other.

Mike Patterson Xingyi(Shanxi)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGnihFoGad8
(Shanxi linkage)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9deW2aZlww

Hebei Style Xingyi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQZ3xn-UmjI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHEbJxX_vV0

Yes, there are minor stylistic differences but I see equal fajing and crips movements in all the depictions.

I see flowery movements from Mike Patterson, in some movements, as I do from the Hebei teacher.

Shanxi also has weapons sets.

Just for the record, Shanxi is in northern china.

Thanks I addressed that and then removed a couple posts to trollshido.

Forgot to add it to the above post.

Also for the record Mike Patterson does Hebei style. All xingyi lineage that stems from the Tangshoutao is Hebei style. I don't know why he says he's teaching Shanxi but he's not. Tim Cartmell used to teach Shanxi and if you can turn up some vids of him doing it you'll see the differences.
Hebei style has weapon sets as well just not nearly as many.

Also for the record Mike Patterson does Hebei style. All xingyi lineage that stems from the Tangshoutao is Hebei style. I don't know why he says he's teaching Shanxi but he's not. Tim Cartmell used to teach Shanxi and if you can turn up some vids of him doing it you'll see the differences.
Hebei style has weapon sets as well just not nearly as many.
Shhhhhh I was hoping he would notice that between the videos posted. Oh well.

Yeah, and as to the hardcore question, I would say there's no meaningful difference. That's up to the practitioner. I've only ever read the "Shanxi is the rarest and most powerful" on Shanxi websites.