You are a coward, and a liar.

You are a disgrace to MA's.

Please do not derail this thread any further. If you want to discuss it, do it here.

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1364045#post1364045

Its all about you being a coward. Have fun.


Oldman34, please leave this thread if you are going to keep getting off subject. If you feel you have any valid points of view to share or discuss with real martial artists, then please post. If not please be quiet.

Glad you left TKD. Did all of us a big service. Now try shutting your mouth and let the adults speak.

Nottaproblem. Consider it done.

Best Wishes,

Bruce

Nottaproblem. Consider it done.

Best Wishes,

Bruce


Bruce, you know I wasn't meaning, or talking about you?

Mark

Oooppss..

I saw "Glad" and thought I was getting in the middle of something.

Guess we can chalk it up to "low-self-esteem", yes? :-)

Best Wishes,

Bruce

Oooppss..

I saw "Glad" and thought I was getting in the middle of something.

Guess we can chalk it up to "low-self-esteem", yes? :-)

Best Wishes,

Bruce


I think you must be a pretty neat person Bruce. I could learn to have a more relaxed attitude like you. I wish you the best as well.

Mark

I hear a lot of talk about making TKD "self defense" oriented, as it was meant to be. But, personally, I don't like the term SD now-a-days. It means too many things to different people. To some it means an RBSD-type approach to training. To some it is used to denote a non (or anti) sport fighting approach. To others it means hardcore fight training. And those are but a few examples. That is why I prefer the simpler and more straight forward terminology of fighting.

Whether it is in the ring (sport) or on the street (SD), martial arts should be about fighting. If TKD, as a style, wants respect (in any venue) it needs to be about fighting, period. That means hard core training consisting of hard contact and realistic sparring. That means being able to represent in sport fighting venues. And it means being realistic for a street fight/SD situation.

Looking back at the history of TKD, I'm not sure it ever met those ideals. But one thing is sure. It doesn't meet them today. And that's what needs to change about TKD. IMO.

Thnaks.. if you do I'd be interested on your views on it. I think only one poster on this thread has a copy.. much of what this thread is about is already touched upon in the book!


Stuart

Make that 2 posters

It's a good book, and has already influenced practice at our dojang.

I hear a lot of talk about making TKD "self defense" oriented, as it was meant to be. But, personally, I don't like the term SD now-a-days. It means too many things to different people. To some it means an RBSD-type approach to training. To some it is used to denote a non (or anti) sport fighting approach. To others it means hardcore fight training. And those are but a few examples. That is why I prefer the simpler and more straight forward terminology of fighting.

Whether it is in the ring (sport) or on the street (SD), martial arts should be about fighting. If TKD, as a style, wants respect (in any venue) it needs to be about fighting, period. That means hard core training consisting of hard contact and realistic sparring. That means being able to represent in sport fighting venues. And it means being realistic for a street fight/SD situation.

Looking back at the history of TKD, I'm not sure it ever met those ideals. But one thing is sure. It doesn't meet them today. And that's what needs to change about TKD. IMO.

Would you view TKD as more "combat-worthy" were it more like Muay Thai? The reason that I ask is that I hear a lot of waffling over whether an art is better as grappling or striking; a standing approach or going to the ground.

Personally I favor striking and kicking as set-ups for a projection or throw (preferably into some element in the environment). However, I DO believe that a strike or kick ought be used with sufficient commitment to do damge in its own right (after the fashion of KIM Moo-woong rather than JI Han Jae for you "Hapkido lurkers"). Thoughts?

Best Wishes,

Bruce

glad, how often do you spar against anyone outside your school? or even in your school?

Make that 2 posters

It's a good book, and has already influenced practice at our dojang.

Cool. It would be good to hear "how" it has influenced your practice on the other thread: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=50198&page=21 as well as your thoughts on the book itself.

And thanks for getting a copy.

Regards,

Stuart

Would you view TKD as more "combat-worthy" were it more like Muay Thai?

For me, it's all about training methodology and not individual techniques. Though, if trained properly some techniques might be culled out as unworkable, I believe there would be a significant amount of TKD techniques remaining to keep a distinct feel to the art. Since they would be trained properly, however, the practicioners would be able to apply them much more realistically than is commonly seen from TKD people today.

And I would never expect TKD to become a "complete art" or MMA by incorporating grappling. I'll get my grappling from a good grappling art, thank you very much. But it would be nice if TKD were, you know, a good stand up art! And currently I don't see it as such.

For me, it's all about training methodology and not individual techniques. Though, if trained properly some techniques might be culled out as unworkable, I believe there would be a significant amount of TKD techniques remaining to keep a distinct feel to the art. Since they would be trained properly, however, the practicioners would be able to apply them much more realistically than is commonly seen from TKD people today.

This has been my contention all along. Some people feel that if you remove the things that arent as viable in a SD defense situation then you are getting away from the art.
I have to agree with them. Teach a jump spinning hook kick, if someone finds that it works well for them then great, If someone finds just the opposite, then great.

I changed my opinion on the subject of removing techniques from TKD because I realized through this thread that by removing techniques we would be limiting a practitoner to a set number of options for an attack.



And I would never expect TKD to become a "complete art" or MMA by incorporating grappling. I'll get my grappling from a good grappling art, thank you very much. But it would be nice if TKD were, you know, a good stand up art! And currently I don't see it as such.

No grappling will be incorporated. Like you said, get your grappling from a good grappling art.
I see TKD becoming a more complete stand up art. As many have said (including you) this will require better sparring and training techniques.

Some think that it would be best to start to use these re-introduced techniques in a tourney format, for better exposure, and if tourneys are allowing the techniques then people will train in them to keep up with the times.

Others feel the opposite.

I am on the fence with it.

Your opinion please.........

Cool. It would be good to hear "how" it has influenced your practice on the other thread: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=50198&page=21 as well as your thoughts on the book itself.

And thanks for getting a copy.

Regards,

Stuart

Ok Ok get off my back Stuart...sheesh. I am going to order a copy next week when I get paid.

Are you happy now?


:)


I started this thread to better discuss the idea Stuart laid out in another thread. Once I stopped talking and started listening to him, it made a great deal of sense.

I inivited him over here, so that he could expound on the nature of his book, and what the book tries to accomplish. I have to give him full credit for this train of thought.

Oooppss..

I saw "Glad" and thought I was getting in the middle of something.

Guess we can chalk it up to "low-self-esteem", yes? :-)

Best Wishes,

Bruce


Bruce is a trained killer. Dont let his "low self esteem" talk fool you.

For me, it's all about training methodology and not individual techniques.
Me too!


Though, if trained properly some techniques might be culled out as unworkable, I believe there would be a significant amount of TKD techniques remaining to keep a distinct feel to the art.
Agreed again.. horse for courses!


I'll get my grappling from a good grappling art, thank you very much.
I dont disagree with this.. but many people just dont ahve time to train in muliple arts.. I have just been trying to encourage a 17 year to train more than once per week.. but he's already to busy.. so rather than just leave the gap, I feel perhaps an instructor should try to fill it if possible, even if its not ideal. There a good interview with Loren Christensen in this months "Combat" magazine where he says (amongst other interesting things) that martial arts these days are many things to many people and they *can* be just that! He has a point I belive! Im not into McDojo's and want my training rooted in SD, but neither am I that interested in competing in UFC events.. my art has to be what I want out of it!


Stuart

Ok Ok get off my back Stuart...sheesh. I am going to order a copy next week when I get paid.
Im not on your back!!!!!!!!!!!


Are you happy now?
hell, Im happy if I get through a day without another drama in my life.. so I guess today I am LOL!



I started this thread to better discuss the idea Stuart laid out in another thread. Once I stopped talking and started listening to him, it made a great deal of sense.
Why thank you, though that was not neccesary! I am happy people want to look at their art in a productive manner to improve their training! I know its like flogging a dead horse as Ive been pushing for it for years, so more power to you for doing so (though arguing with others aint gonna get no one nowhere fast.. make your peace both of you!!)


I inivited him over here, so that he could expound on the nature of his book, and what the book tries to accomplish. I have to give him full credit for this train of thought.
again, theres no need for credit.. everyone has their own ideas which is the point of a discussion. Mine seem to work for me and what I teach and if I can be of use to others, then Im glad to have played a small part!


Stuart

Ps. You may hate the book when you get it!