:wtfgif9fr
Apparently this guy (http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/mindbodyspirit/History.html) learned so much from Sin Kwang The' that the only way he could progress was to become a grandmaster in his own style. Hold the phone! I guess he really did learn something from ole SKT. Way to go, douchebag!

Some guys across the river in the Clarkesville/New Albany Indiana area apparently just pulled away from Sin The in the last few months as well. I met one of the guy's black belt students when I was getting ready to take the DLAB. We got to bullshitting about martial arts and I ended up giving him some tips about his triangle choke. All in all, a very random encounter, so I don't remember the name they changed their art to . . .

http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/mindbodyspirit/images/HeadsofSilentDragon.jpg

The guy on the right looks like a spasticated version of Bam Magera.

It appears that the Soards did the same thing. They now call their school the Chinese Shao-Lin Center, not Shaolin Do. Strangely, Sin The shows up on their web site a few times

http://www.shao-lin.com/Category.cfm?CategoryID=24

but they no longer show up as masters on his site

http://www.sinthe.com/masters.html

There are quite a few that dont show up on that site. Its actually the SDA site which is a organization headed by Sin The's right hand man Bill Lenord.
I think alot of the fallouts are between the diffrent masters and not Sin The' himself.

Woops that link was to Bills school and not the SDA site but still what I was getting at.

I seem to remember the Soards showing up on the more extensive list a few years back. I know that there was some animosity between them and some other groups, but I never really heard the extent of it. I asked some people I know that are still in the system about their disappearance recently, but never got an answer.

The Soard's site does refer to them only as "Elder Masters," not "Grandmaster" as the first guy calls himself. I wonder if his use of Sin The's picture on his site in any way implies that there's still a connection?

I am currently attending a San Antonio SD school. I've read varying posts by people saying mostly that it depends on where you learn SD as to whether it's "good" or not. Anyone else been to the San Antonio variety?

I'm not sure how they teach down in San Antonio, but I imagine that your school could matter a lot, based on what I've heard here.

In general, I thought that the school I was in was pretty decent. We did a lot of hard contact, continuous sparring, and there were none of the McDojo trappings I've heard so much about.

On the other hand, I think that the system, at least what I've seen of it (which is quite a bit), has some down sides. First, I always thought that there was way too much emphasis on kata at the expense of other training methods. Second, there is no really defined system as I'd normally understand it, just some of this and some of that without getting any depth in any specific area. Of course, you can get more specialized after black belt. I'd also hold out the same criticism with the weapons training they offer. Lots of different stuff, no depth.

Also, a lot of the material is too odd and stylized to be that useful, in my opinion. I think you were the one who mentioned the brown belt bird forms. I'd put those out there as an example of this. The system also lacks any grappling work to speak of.

The up side to the system seems to be that you never really have an excuse to get bored with it, and it certainly kept me in shape. You don't see any fat masters on their web sites (at least none that I've come across).

Also, a lot of the material is too odd and stylized to be that useful, in my opinion. I think you were the one who mentioned the brown belt bird forms. I'd put those out there as an example of this. The system also lacks any grappling work to speak of.This is basically what my roommate (who is an SD black belt that no longer trains) said.

From what I've encountered from sparring with random SD people and just bullshitting with them about martial arts (This is Kentucky, so it is not hard to find people that have trained or still do train in SD), this would also be my opinion but I haven't trained in the style, so take that with a grain of salt. I have seen the book they used to make you buy with all the forms in it, and it is a ridiculous number.

The guy I met from the DLAB test said they actually practice throwing and some basic positional grappling with submissions (as well as doing live rolls), but a qualified instructor doesn't pop in all that often to teach them new stuff, so it is likely a lot of the blind leading the blind. Still, seemed like a good first step to me.

Personally, I would rather spend a month learning a new way to punch someone in the face than a new form, but that's just me. I like being told directly what I am learning and why (At a certain point the "light" seems to click on and I no longer need to have everything explained, but I'd still rather be treated as a total newb than have an instructor assume I already know it all).

The only other odd bit I have to share about my SD encounter while I was waiting to take the DLAB is that he was telling me about how they spend a lot of time trying to get into the "mental states" of the animals they emulate the forms of, and about having some sort of "fight or die" mentality. Seemed to be an odd contrast to the training I've had, which was always geared toward staying calm when you are being attacked.

The people I trained with had no ground grappling experience to speak of. There was some aiki jutsu brought in here and there, but this definitely didn't come from Shaolin do, and seemed to be frowned upon by the higher ups in the area.

I've never heard the "fight or die" thing mentioned in the context of Shaolin do, however, I did hear of it in the context of Kune Tao, which speaks about "intent." As I understood it (from the brief time I was able to train this system), this was a mindset where you would do whatever it took to win, almost like a rage, for the lack of a better word.

As far as stylized form go, there were a lot of forms that seemed pretty direct and to the point (after black), however, there were others that seemed a lot more like Wushu. The birds were probably the strangest, in my opinion. I imagine someone could get something out of them, but they did little for me other than provide exercise.

When did we get to the point that its ok to say nice things about Shaolin-Don't?

It sucks.
It is outright bullshit.
They have 3 people nationally that can fight and they all came from other styles.

Please in this one instance remain biased and ignorant.

I'm currently seeking other CMA in san antonio. Might have a good lead, but I'll know for sure in a day or two.

When did we get to the point that its ok to say nice things about Shaolin-Don't?

It sucks.
It is outright bullshit.
They have 3 people nationally that can fight and they all came from other styles.

Please in this one instance remain biased and ignorant.

WhiteShark spin kicks the correct in family jewels.

These are indeed sad times.

One other thing struck me as unusual about the system. The "sparring techniques" taught, which are pretty much basic, straightforward kickboxing type stuff, were all done out of a southpaw stance. That is, the right leg was forward. No idea why.

Kepetri, near as I can figure the sparring techs are that way cuz the majority of the attacks are done with the leading hand/foot. As for the "sparring" in class they teach no joint/head attacks, which pretty much just leaves midsection, so the sparring techs can't really be applied. Sucks. They do have a separate class for sparring and I went to one. It seemed a little more intensive, but again no head/joint...I showed up with headgear and mouthpiece and basically got laughed at. When I asked about it, I got told "we don't do head strikes here." So much for sparring class.

I have met a few good people that came from Shaolin Do. It seems to be a starting point for alot of martial artists in Ky. Most I know have went on to other systems or have split away from the organizations and expanded beyond what they were being taught before.
I still say the whole art is based on some major BS.