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Fantasy Warrior
12/06/2005 8:31am,
My niece has a burst ear drum. Must be bloody painful but she is walking about ok. So how debilitating is the supposedly effective ear-drum clap likely to be in a live situation?

It is obvious that the ear clap move could burst an ear drum. But:
* Is it likely to immediately debilitate the attacker? (as generally believed)
* How likely is it that the burst eardrum will occur from the clap?

Andrew Green
12/06/2005 9:48am,
Testing it will get me in trouble, so I just won't depend on it to do anything in particular.... If by some strange bit of luck I was ever in a position to do it, and did do it, any efects would be a bonus :)

Kamon Guy
12/06/2005 10:15am,
I guess the idea is that you are taking away a sensory perception before the person has a chance to cope with it. I imagine your niece has had time to develop the ability to cope with this.

If you attack a guy and you suddenly go deaf, you would be very disorientated because your body has never experienced it.

I don't think we will ever know for sure unless there are some unfortunate souls on Bullshido who have experienced it.

Odacon
12/06/2005 2:29pm,
Has this ever been documented as being true? I agree a strong slap is an effective strike but bursting someones eardrum with one seems unlikely.

Bang!
12/06/2005 2:34pm,
I had an eardrum burst once from a slap to the ear during sparring. It hurt, but not enough to anything more than distract me for a split-second. I didn't even realize that it was damaged until I plugged my nose and exhaled (to clear my sinuses) and air escaped from the ear.

I saw a specialist, who tested my hearing and didn't detect any damage . . . The ear itself healed up within a couple of weeks.

This is not something that you can count on at all to end a fight.

Matt Bernius
12/06/2005 3:52pm,
Thanks for that post RM. Look boys and girls, here is the deal. There is no such thing as a magic bullet in self defense. If you are instructing you need to convey this. You can not count on burst eardrums or blows to the groin. You can only count on yourself. And you need to keep fighting until you can escape regardless of what happens.

Ok, now on the flipside, as RM said, it did throw him for a moment. And in a self defense situation a moment is exactly what you are looking for. The tide can change in that moment. And if your opponent pauses, you just bought yourself a free hit or escape.

So in that respect I think this is an excellent concept to teach. Just do not over invest it with automatic stopping power.

- Matt

Iron Rooster
12/06/2005 3:58pm,
Whatever dude. First sign of aggression, just spear hand the throat and knee em in the face. That is a magic bullet.

Jaguar Wong
12/06/2005 5:37pm,
Thanks for that post RM. Look boys and girls, here is the deal. There is no such thing as a magic bullet in self defense.

That's why real bullets are used. You don't need to find unicorns to enchant them.

Fantasy Warrior
12/06/2005 5:47pm,
Matt = preaching to the converted.

re the slap. Cupped hand is normally suggested.

Re going death... when I'm high on Adrenaline I sorta loose a lot of hearing perception anyway, probably as my brain prioritizes other senses. Everything sounds distant and combined with rapid processing of visual data (slow motion) it is a bit like a dream.. until you get whacked and suddenly wake up..

Wounded Ronin
12/06/2005 5:52pm,
I didn't know that anyone even considered the old ear drum slap to be incapacitating in the first place.

Yrkoon9
12/06/2005 5:58pm,
It is disorienting for a few moments. I am not a big believer in guaranteed fight stoppers.

Look at it like this, if you could land an openhand slap hard enough to break someones eardrum you could have probably landed a closed hand punch to the temple or jaw for the KO. All are improbable targets that rely as much on luck as skill when aiming for a particular target with a particular strike.

IMO if you are serious about busting someones eardrum it would be better to KO or choke them out and then ram a pencil into their ear.

However, do not underestimate the power of the groin slap, eardrum burst, palm heel to the nose driving-the-nose-bone-into-the-brain, 5 finger palm exploding heart technique. Especially for self defense.

Neildo
12/06/2005 6:16pm,
The eardrum-burst double hand clap doesn't even work in the movies.

I've seen countless cheezy action movies where the hero does it to the bad guy.

Bad guy takes a step back, shakes his head, and continues beating the ever-living-**** out of the protagonist.

Just do a spinning hook kick to the brain stem and be a hero.

Matt Bernius
12/06/2005 6:59pm,
However, do not underestimate the power of the groin slap, eardrum burst, palm heel to the nose driving-the-nose-bone-into-the-brain, 5 finger palm exploding heart technique. Especially for self defense.Agreed. This is not a sparring or competition scenario. Again the two things most attackers fear are getting hurt or getting caught. That level of fighting back may (note the "may") be enough to descourage the attack.

The key thing is not setting people up for the cognative dissonance of "the technique that I thought was going to stop the person cold didn't... now what."

As far as the blow to the jaw, the eardrum shot is easier and requires less body shift to work and disorient. That, at least in my mind, makes it a better choice for an unarmed person. Not to mention that if you can get your hands to that slap, you're also in position to tear or otherwise damage the ear. And losing part of an ear (I'd imagine) would have a killer psycological effect.

And Kick, I figured I was preaching. But I also figured that you were asking the question to confirm what you already knew to be the case.

- Matt

Kamon Guy
12/09/2005 8:54am,
The eardrum-burst double hand clap doesn't even work in the movies.

I've seen countless cheezy action movies where the hero does it to the bad guy.

Bad guy takes a step back, shakes his head, and continues beating the ever-living-**** out of the protagonist.

Just do a spinning hook kick to the brain stem and be a hero.

I was speaking to a friend of mine who had this done to him in a fight. He said that he had a ringing in the ears and it made him feel a bit disorientated, but he recovered and managed to win the day.

I would say that it is probably 50/50 whether it has any effect or not. Some people might shake it off, others it might pop their ear drums whichj I am sure would top the fight.

I agree that there are no guaranteed fight stoppers. That guy who got his leg broken in Cage Rage wanted to carry on!

chaosexmachina
12/09/2005 5:44pm,
This is something my dad told me to do for self defence when I was a little kid. Never tried it though...

Neildo
12/09/2005 5:59pm,
Bah, i'd never bother with something like this.

If I had time to straight-arm slap a guy in the side of the head, and he didn't do anything about it other than get slapped, well.....Hammer fist to temple. That's more likely a fight stopper than trying to burst the poor guys eardrums.