Hi all,

I'm new to the group.

It was recommended by a friend to look for a Judo school in my area.

My primary choice was wanting to practice Tai Chi Quan, but MANY schools don't teach the "self defense" aspect. Most teachers and schools focus on the healt aspect of Tai Chi and what you see mostly is watered down versions of Tai Chi.

He recommended Judo because he said thanks to Jiguro Kanos efforts Judo, its training, its traditions, are available globally. You can live in just about any country and still get quality training, and information about why you do what you do. Its concepts, ideas, and applications are widespread and available to all. He has been practicing Tai Chi as a martial art, not for health, for many years and has much respect for the martial principles and techniques of Judo.

Unlike Tai Chi which has been watered down and not taught as a martial art.

I have observed Judo in the past and see similarities with Judo and Tai Chi.

I want to practice Judo for the self defense and NOT for the sport.

I was wondering if there are schools that will focus on the "martial aspect" and not the sport?

And, how effective is Judo in situations that ARE NOT IDEAL, like self defense. Self defense in the real world very rarely occurs in ideal conditions like a sport a ring and a controlled environment.

I'm not asking about street fighting.

Street fighting and self defense are much different and people tend to mix them up.

Take Care,

Marc

I started Judo several months ago after a background in FMA and TCMAs. I've found that it is very useful for self defense. The techniques you learn are trained under full-resistance... so you can train actually applying it to people in a realistic way.

The downside is that you wear a gi, which makes some throws or chokes difficult to do in a self defense situation. However the gi really is a training tool in many ways that help beginners learn how to do judo. It doesn't take much thinking to figure out which techniques work well without a gi, and how to convert gi based techniques to no gi techniques. Also much of what you do with a gi you can to do people with standard street clothing.

My recommendation would be to ensure that the club you go to does about 50% stand-up throws, to 50% groundwork... the groundwork component is very useful for self-defense, but a sports-based club might not focus on it that much.

Make sure that the club you go to has people who are bigger and meaner than you are... size really matters and if you want to develop good technique it is better to train with people who scare you than people who you can toss around.

Lastly, I've found that my Judo experience has made me re-examine drills that I do in other styles and recreate them as sparring-based drills that allow more 'opponent resistance'. Drills that don't have this component are only good for conditioning or learning basic patterns.

all of the judo clubs i have come across are focused on sport judo. i think it would be very difficult to find a school that focuses on judo for self defense.

however, judo is a good martial art for self defense. getting thrown hurts when you know how to fall, and you are on a mat. if you throw some untrained guy on a hard surface, they are probably not coming up. in that aspect sport judo can be good for self defense. however, most judo schools wont teach you any weapon defense, if that is what you are looking for.

Hi all,

I'm new to the group.

It was recommended by a friend to look for a Judo school in my area.


Welcome! I hope you have a thick skin!




My primary choice was wanting to practice Tai Chi Quan, but MANY schools don't teach the "self defense" aspect. Most teachers and schools focus on the healt aspect of Tai Chi and what you see mostly is watered down versions of Tai Chi.

Why? I'm honestly asking because that is so rarely mentioned as anyone's first choice of arts for self defence.




He recommended Judo because he said thanks to Jiguro Kanos efforts Judo, its training, its traditions, are available globally. You can live in just about any country and still get quality training, and information about why you do what you do. Its concepts, ideas, and applications are widespread and available to all. He has been practicing Tai Chi as a martial art, not for health, for many years and has much respect for the martial principles and techniques of Judo.

Judo is cool. I'm curious though. why does it matter if it is available globally? Isn't it more important that it be available locally (at least, more important to you)?
The "available to all" comment seems a bit odd but maybe I'm misunderstanding.




Unlike Tai Chi which has been watered down and not taught as a martial art.

I have observed Judo in the past and see similarities with Judo and Tai Chi.


Um.... really?




I want to practice Judo for the self defense and NOT for the sport.

I was wondering if there are schools that will focus on the "martial aspect" and not the sport?

Most definitely. Here's a hint though - you'll have more success getting school suggestions if you - I dunno - tell people where you are...



And, how effective is Judo in situations that ARE NOT IDEAL, like self defense. Self defense in the real world very rarely occurs in ideal conditions like a sport a ring and a controlled environment.

In my admittedly amateur opinion, good judo seems well respected. Like all arts, its only as good as the person using it.



I'm not asking about street fighting.

Street fighting and self defense are much different and people tend to mix them up.

K, you've really lost me. You want to learn self defence, not sport fighting. You specifically want "self defence in the real world", not in a ring or anywhere with controlled environment. But you don't want to learn street fighting....

Where exactly were you planning to be attacked? Your living room? :dontknow:

K, you've really lost me. You want to learn self defence, not sport fighting. You specifically want "self defence in the real world", not in a ring or anywhere with controlled environment. But you don't want to learn street fighting....

Where exactly were you planning to be attacked? Your living room? :dontknow:
LMAO - made me laugh *trying to imagine training session for living room self-defense including "use of TV remote to block strike", "avoiding bashing shin on coffee table during low-kick" & "use of TV as distraction for attacker"*

If I ever get attacked here I hope they have the decency to wait for the ad-break.

The sporting aspect that you're trying to avoid is exactly why judo is so effective in "the street".

Most judo clubs you find will be sport-clubs. There ARE a few judo clubs that practice "traditional/old-style" judo.

You have to be careful when you are evaluating these clubs. I have noticed sometimes they are run by people with no affiliation with the national judo body - so they are a "standalone" club and often "overlook" things like insurance.

Some are run by disgruntled former national-body judoka who dont like sport judo because it wont allow them to teach judo "their way". They often have a contempt for "sport judo" saying it is not "real" Judo and "dont believe in competitions" because the rules are "so restrictive" etc. The worst of them have 9th/10th dan instructors who have graded themselves in their own affiliation & their grades are not kodokan/national body recognised (they wake up one morning' look in the mirror & decide they deserve a higher grade).

The decent clubs will encourage their judoka to go to competitions - the cr@p ones treat these judoka who WANT to compete as having made a pact with satan himself.

Not all clubs are bad, just like not all "sport judo" clubs ae good - but just evaluate for yourself with a bit of a critical eye. If they dont practive full-contact sparring then dont bother with them IMHO.

As a newb (like me) you are forgiven for misconceiving sport and self defense as being mutually exclusive ends. Really they aren't, sport training is excellent for developing the core self defense skills.

Imagine a boxer who has trained to compete in the ring. Just how physically tough and dangerous they are compared to most MAers out there who train for the street.

Its a bit like the difference between traditional juijitsu, which was practised without aliveness when compared to Judo (and its descendandt BJJ) who practise techniques that can be demonstrated to work against an opponent who is fully resisting.

The quality of the delivery of techniques IMO is just a hell of a lot better, and it can be learned faster because you are really trying to apply the stuff not just doing compliant drills.

Ziggy much?

And, how effective is Judo in situations that ARE NOT IDEAL, like self defense. Self defense in the real world very rarely occurs in ideal conditions like a sport a ring and a controlled environment.

More effective than most of the arts that bill themselves as self-defence, not sport.

You see, there are different ways to train your techniques. Some people train their techniques in the air against imaginary opponents. Unfortunately, pretty much everything works on an imaginary opponent, including lots of things that don't work on real ones. Some people train techniques as a counter to an incoming attack, turn about, one person strikes, the other person counters. But it's hard to adapt this to real fighting - it's always dealing with an idealised situation, where your attacker does what you want him to do and then responds to your counter-attack in the way you want him to. It's very useful for learning the techniques, but that's about it. The best way of training is to give you an opponent who's trying to "win" within whatever parameters the drill has, with a variety of means allowed to do so. This won't help much with learning new techniques, but it lets you adapt the techniques you do know to all kinds of positions and situations; you'll almost always be employing your techniques from positions that aren't ideal, and making them work anyway. This is the common thread that runs through all the most effective arts, and it's at the very heart of judo.

You will learn flexibility and adaptability from judo; it'll give you a distinct edge in an unarmed fight, it'll make you hard to knock off your feet and give you options if you are. It won't teach you to deal effectively with armed men while unarmed yourself, but very few arts do, especially not most of the ones that claim to. This seems a paradox, but most of such arts teach choreography with compliant attackers, not fighting.

There are flaws in the art that result from people gaming its sporting rules. Throws where you drop onto both knees are fine and well on mats, but likely to **** your knees up on hard surfaces. Curling up into a ball to defend when groundfighting is not ideal for self-defence. However, neither option is forced on you; you can take a self-defence route in a sport class, fight from your back in guard on the ground, work on throws which do not leave you at risk of injuring yourself and still be successful in competition as well as gaining real fighting skills.