Recent threads have often been confusing in terms of not understanding each others' Martial Arts properly. I feel this set of Easy questions will adequately show what the misunderstandings are. We should talk in terms of MOVES or Techniques , not the Martial Arts specific terminology’s. Possibly the training methods could be discussed in brief but not necessarily.

The question are in terms of what I understand, so I'm not going to be using TMA/non-sport terminology’s in ALL of the questions.

[NOTE: these are generally aimed at people like KFDW, Sam Harber, Dotcher etc who's Martial Arts I don't think I understand, or at least hope I don't understand, however I would appreciate it if you ALL posted a reply.] [The first answer will be considered the move/technique most likely to be used, however an alternative answer should be given if possible. Please describe the move if it has a foreign terminology or just give the move's name in English.] [Hand-to-hand ONLY, no weapons. No "running". <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle> ][Please give HONEST answers, what you would almost definitely do.]

The QUESTIONS - Striking and Grappling: (these are actually so basic they may seem patronizing, but I assure you I don't mean them to be <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>.)


GRAPPLING :

What would you do...

(1) If somebody "Shoots" (goes to tackle your legs) in on you?

(2) Clinches with you (from standing) and tries to take you down in whichever way ("biting" is not an accepted answer because they may be just as likely to do that to you; not that it wouldn't hurt <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>)?

(3) If on the ground and somebody tried to "mount" you, punching you on the way, what would you do?

(4) If they have the mount or "side mount" (on top of you) and (a) begin to strike you with punches and/or knees (b) go for an arm bar/arm lock ?

(5) If on the floor and in somebody’s "Guard"?

(6) If, upon having your head pulled down whilst standing, a Choke (a "guillotine") is applied.

STRIKING

What would you do...

(1) If somebody throws any number of punches at you, with the intent to KO you, this COULD BE followed or started by a hard kick to the leg, a knee or a clinch etc?

(2) If a "clinch" is applied to your neck, and the person begins to knee, possibly head butt and elbow you to anywhere?

(3) What would your general defensive be if you're being punched at and/or somebody is striking at you?

(4) What STRIKES would you generally use when fighting i.e. your most used STRIKES, not necessarily your favorite moves, but the ones you use most often to effect?

(5) Would you agree that moves are generally universal, that a punch can only generally be done in a certain, specific amount of ways to any effect (i.e. hitting hard and fast)?

(6) Would you agree that conditioning (including weight) plays a big part in how much strength can be applied to a technique, and the amount of time somebody can fight before becoming exhausted (techniques come in to play here too, because of how difficult or easy they can be)?

Finally

How would you generally train these Techniques and/or Moves?


*Any posts relating to the validity of these question, that they don't show what a martial artist knows will almost definitely be unanswered or ignored. <img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

** Please, only give honest answers to the questions.

*** Questions should be answered in the format "Grappling: (1) Answer here (2)..., "Striking:..." etc.

**** Do NOT, under ANY circumstances try to "0wn" me, however you might go about doing that. <img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle>

I thank you for any any appropriate answers given, they will be much apprecaited.




Movie Quote: http://funwavs.com/wavfile.php?quote=603&view=1 - Full Metal Jacket (http://kubrickfilms.warnerbros.com/video_detail/fmj/index.html)

**** Do NOT, under ANY circumstances try to "0wn" me, however you might go about doing that. :)

http://www.alt-fs.com/owned.jpg

edit: seriously, I'll answer it after work. Sorry, couldn't resist.



Edited by - Mercurius on March 29 2003 12:50:50

Answers Blade wants to hear:

Striking (1,2,3,4,5) Jump guard, striking sucks, BJJ 0wnZ!! Zhoooooo Zitsuuuuuuu (<-- what BJJ zombies say)

Grappling (1,2,3,4,5) Can't do ****!! Grappling 0wnZ!! maybe GnP, cause that's what they do in the UFC/PRIDE

ttt - waiting for ANY REPLIES, ANY REPLIES at all? Not even one person? <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>



Movie Quote: http://funwavs.com/wavfile.php?quote=603&view=1 - Full Metal Jacket (http://kubrickfilms.warnerbros.com/video_detail/fmj/index.html)

ugh....such long answers are needed, this would be easier in a conversation (verbally)

some other WC guys post here, i can't really since i am very MMA

--
Hard work, Patience, Dedication.
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed later.

yeah you can ANYONE can reply. That's one reply so far (from pizdoff), however you did't answer the questions! :)



Movie Quote: http://funwavs.com/wavfile.php?quote=603&view=1 - Full Metal Jacket (http://kubrickfilms.warnerbros.com/video_detail/fmj/index.html)

GRAPPLING :

What would you do...

(1) If somebody "Shoots" (goes to tackle your legs) in on you?
sprawl or if you're really good flying knee ala anderson silva

(2) Clinches with you (from standing) and tries to take you down in whichever way ("biting" is not an accepted answer because they may be just as likely to do that to you; not that it wouldn't hurt )?
do not let him get his underhooks in, watch out for knees. alternate strikes to the rib and the head. so many variables on this one, get mario sperry tapes.

(3) If on the ground and somebody tried to "mount" you, punching you on the way, what would you do?
protect head, try to escape or at least get open guard.

(4) If they have the mount or "side mount" (on top of you) and (a) begin to strike you with punches and/or knees (b) go for an arm bar/arm lock ?
(a) escape, again so many variables.
(b) same as above

(5) If on the floor and in somebody’s "Guard"?
closed guard, open it.
open guard, pass it.

(6) If, upon having your head pulled down whilst standing, a Choke (a "guillotine") is applied.
mind your neck, do not let him pull guard on you, escape.

STRIKING

What would you do...

(1) If somebody throws any number of punches at you, with the intent to KO you, this COULD BE followed or started by a hard kick to the leg, a knee or a clinch etc?
no short answer.

(2) If a "clinch" is applied to your neck, and the person begins to knee, possibly head butt and elbow you to anywhere?
hug his waist, and trip him.

(3) What would your general defensive be if you're being punched at and/or somebody is striking at you?
teeb.

(4) What STRIKES would you generally use when fighting i.e. your most used STRIKES, not necessarily your favorite moves, but the ones you use most often to effect?
jab, cross, roundhouse

(5) Would you agree that moves are generally universal, that a punch can only generally be done in a certain, specific amount of ways to any effect (i.e. hitting hard and fast)?
no comment

(6) Would you agree that conditioning (including weight) plays a big part in how much strength can be applied to a technique, and the amount of time somebody can fight before becoming exhausted (techniques come in to play here too, because of how difficult or easy they can be)?
yes and dont forget experience

Finally

How would you generally train these Techniques and/or Moves?
no short answer

hey brand... got an answer other than your usual
"bjj sux harhar" answer? I'm intrigued!

I feel like trolling today. Dunno why...

<Me> John, what do you know about Zen Buddhism? <John> *smacks me*
<John> I'd have to smack you sometime...

BJJ don't SuX d00d. BJJ 0wnZ strikers

quiet Brand you ground roller with men!


wtf is teeb? lol

exactly Rellik-no short answer, even many situations

--
Hard work, Patience, Dedication.
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed later.

Grappling:
1) Sprawl and punch downward in side of person's face.

2) Counter with my own take down or let person take me down then quickly get onto top of the person before we crash the ground.

3) ?

4) A: Lean up and grab person (arm around under opponent's arm and other one around the neck, grab both hands together) and turn them to the ground.
B: Spin so my body get into their legs before they can close their legs on my arm.

5) Pound the hell out of their thoart, collar bone, eyes, and other place.

6) Turn my head so I am look to side, shrug my shoulder against person's arms and push the person's arms away. When the hold is loosen a bit, suddenly fall into sitting position or trip the person if possible. Probably even get person in side head hold if possible.

Striking:
1) I would evade it and do "Sliding throw" (when you move toward person, grab him under arm and around neck, trip him over onto back of his head or upper back first).

2)I would grab person's legs to cause them to fall down or drop to knees and do silat take down.

3) Dodge and evade then quickly strikes when the person left themself in open then move back and start over. I don't like to go blocks to blocks stuff.

4) I usually punch with back of my fist (surprise element) or quick straight punch.

5) I am not crazy about how to punch. I would punch any way as long as it work and have some effective. If it don't work, I would use my shins (pretty much a last resort for stand up before going to ground).

6) Yes, I have got in fight with many people who was really musclar, small and quick, or fat and brutally strong. If they can't keep going and aren't well condition, they are unable to fight for long before stopping.

I usually practice those by having people standing steady and move toward them and striking them (non contact) or grab them repeatly. Once I become used to it, I would ask person to do ONLY one move (kick, punch, or whatever) and I would try counter it. Once I get use to doing a certain move for all angles, possible situtation, and other things. I would start sparring with them and try use some of moves I have been practicing. That is the way move can become reflex or instict, so you can do it smoothly once something start.
4)

Just throw rock at it and it will go away.

"I would rather admit I am a lousy student than say I am the best, because once you think you are the best, there is no reason to continue learning."

Grappling

1) Sidestep, strike one of the arms to cause pain, then from there keep them unbalanced for a throw, strike, or lock. Or do a roundoff backhandspring backflip over your shoot, whichever is more convienient...

2) Knee, elbow, trip/throw while watching out for attacks.

3) Try to avoid taking hits, look for leverages and ways to unbalance so you can throw him off the top of you.

4)
a) block punches, look for leverages/locks, try to roll out, clothing choke as a last resort
b) Block the lock

5) Punches to the body, sit up and get out. Get out by any means

relik, although you didn't give specific technqiues for some of the moves - like the guard, I would say tht everything you answered with specific moves was excellent, thats a near "Model" set of answers.

FD:


Counter with my own take down or let person take me down then quickly get onto top of the person before we crash the ground. our own takedown I wuld agree with - but if they take you do it's going to be fast, too fast for you to land on top of them, so I would think they would be on top of you.


other one around the neck The neck? when they have a mount on you and they're goign for an armbar? I'm not sure about that one...


Pound the hell out of their thoart, collar bone, eyes, and other place. but they would grab on to you, and be trying to go for a submission, they would hit back too. You can't hit them very well if they grab on to you WITH a close guard. well som people can, but that's only when they aren't grabbing onto you. But hitting can be a godo thing, yes.

I couldn't argue with your strikng, or instead of striking going for for grappling.





Anybody else?



Movie Quote: http://funwavs.com/wavfile.php?quote=603&view=1 - Full Metal Jacket (http://kubrickfilms.warnerbros.com/video_detail/fmj/index.html)

san soo:

strikng the arm can cause pain, but that is hardly going to stop anybody from shooting in on you.

Backflip? now that wouldn't work, the shoot is too fast.

how could you throw them i they are already near the ground, trying to hold your legs?


(2) they'd being trying to take you down, getting those double underhooks OR a Judo style throw, if you can trip them then yeah that's fine - but they'd be trying to do the same don't forget...They'd fight for it...

(3) OK i partly agree - but how would you avoid being hit? what technqiued would you use to try and get the leverage? how would you accoplish this?

(4)How would you block the pucnhes, "rising blocks", what? Ok you would block the armbar, fair enough - but exactly how? I mean by doing what?

(5) any means being what? situp - so they can armbar you? They would be trying to hold onto your arms... What if you tire yourself about by "getting out by ANY means"? where;s the technqiue? groin strike? what?


Ok Merc - I'll reply to them when you're finished, thanks for taking the time.


Movie Quote: http://funwavs.com/wavfile.php?quote=603&view=1 - Full Metal Jacket (http://kubrickfilms.warnerbros.com/video_detail/fmj/index.html)

Edited by - Blade Windu on March 29 2003 15:11:47

[quote]
GRAPPLING :

What would you do...

(1) If somebody "Shoots" (goes to tackle your legs) in on you?

Sprawl. Get head control, gullotine. Or like most of you lame ass now wrestlers that don't know how to set up a shot properly, side step will pushing you at angle and knocking you the **** out.

(2) Clinches with you (from standing) and tries to take you down in whichever way ("biting" is not an accepted answer because they may be just as likely to do that to you; not that it wouldn't hurt http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/2657/hyaku.gif

Grappling
1)Sidetep, or drop and spread my legs if I'm desperate

2)Hock or shoulder throw, softening with close-quarter stikes first

3)Block his strikes, then go for a sacrifce throw or take the head and take him down your side if possible

4)a)block punches, grab arm for a lock or throw (with legs also)
b)block the lock, possibly manuevering so that it becomes impossible

5)Punch the body, try and knee the groin, elbow the face

6)I would, there are few techniques on the ground that are effective against resisting opponents much stronger then you. Technique can win over endurance, but if you got the stamina it's an advantage

STRIKING

1)Yes, if I interpreted the question correctly

2)outer block (while moving to his side), then apply (lock or stikes if he has whisked away the arm)

3)Guard the face with arm, groin with foreleg and when oopurtunity is seen, knee opponent and go for sacrifice throw

4)side kick, elbow

5)arms up, close in, hands up, legs ready to go up and defend groin, may be varied by lowering the forward arm to give more power to upper rising blocks or to defend the lower body.

6)not necessarily. size and weight are less of an advantage in striking, though, as stregth is ofter gained with a sacrifice of mobility, and they both count.

FINAL
train throws over and over again, increasing speed, work the bag, kata, sparring, groundwork training (usually not all in same day, though)

'phew'

There's something inside me that pulls beneath the surface, consuming...