Maybe they either just dont really know about it, or arent willing to take the time to train it, or maybe they just say "hey, i'm good with what i already know...why should i change what i'm doing if it's already working???"

That doesnt mean it's not viable. You're right, it doesn't. but which is more likely?

Doesn't it stand to reason that if my LIVELIHOOD is based on my success in MMA (personal safety is on the line too!), that i would seek out the training methods that would best equip me to win my fights?

It's very easy for you to stand on the sidelines and say, "oh, they're not doing it properly". Trust me bud, if someone knows the 'true way', there's a lot of money to be made in MMA that they're letting pass them by!

I know that, thats why i said THIS: Granted, you could still be cracked in the back of the head while standing, but at least you have a better chance of defending yourself on your feet, and/or using footwork to evade.

the point is at least you might be able to avoid it if you are on your feet and can MOVE, whereas on the ground that is waaaaay harder to do.

"Standup-versus-ground" debate, the 10-to-the-26th-power retake.

**** the false dichotomies, you don't know where you'll end up in a fight.

Could it be, maybe, that the solution is to learn...both?

Not wanting to shock anyone; just putting that out there...

"Standup-versus-ground" debate, the 10-to-the-26th-power retake.

**** the false dichotomies, you don't know where you'll end up in a fight.

Could it be, maybe, that the solution is to learn...both?

Not wanting to shock anyone; just putting that out there...

Never said it was bad to learn grappling. there is a pic of Bruce Lee putting someone in an armbar, albeit one that would be bad by today's standards.

Speaking of science, did you hear about how it uses evidence to support its claims?

What a novel concept.


Well than why dont you get a really good JKD guy, and a really good MMA guy, and have 2 fights. One in the cage, and one in the street. Then you will have evidence, one way or another.

I actually think, that supplemented with some grappling, JKD could work in the cage, sans the Bil Jee and throat strikes, etc.

You're right, it doesn't. but which is more likely?

Doesn't it stand to reason that if my LIVELIHOOD is based on my success in MMA (personal safety is on the line too!), that i would seek out the training methods that would best equip me to win my fights?

It's very easy for you to stand on the sidelines and say, "oh, they're not doing it properly". Trust me bud, if someone knows the 'true way', there's a lot of money to be made in MMA that they're letting pass them by!

I never said what they werent doing wasnt "proper", just that maybe the vast majority of MMA people are misinformed about JKD. Either that or JKD people just arent interested in competing in MMA, something that i really wish they would do.

Well than why dont you get a really good JKD guy, and a really good MMA guy, and have 2 fights. One in the cage, and one in the street. Then you will have evidence, one way or another.

I actually think, that supplemented with some grappling, JKD could work in the cage, sans the Bil Jee and throat strikes, etc.
See, you are still dong it.

What's even worse, you are changing the parameters you set mid-experiment. You would fail a Science course at this point.

Tim Boetch, Luke Cummo and Ben Suanders are al JKD guys who compete in MMA

They all cross train

MMA is expression of what Bruce Lee was talking about.

What your are saying is "why don't we see more of the Wing Chun JKD started off from.

Especially in the striking area.

I never said what they werent doing wasnt "proper", just that maybe the vast majority of MMA people are misinformed about JKD. Either that or JKD people just arent interested in competing in MMA, something that i really wish they would do. Too bad these super jkd practitioners who could beat up any MMA fighter more than likely DON'T EXIST -- and the burden is on you to show that they do.

Too bad these super jkd practitioners who could beat up any MMA fighter more than likely DON'T EXIST -- and the burden is on you to show that they do.

Goddamnit i'm not saying that JKD is the end all be all of combat and it pwns everything!

i'm just saying that it's a really good system and i'd like it to be represented correctly.

See, you are still dong it.

What's even worse, you are changing the parameters you set mid-experiment. You would fail a Science course at this point.

Why, because i think that in order to use JKD in a cage you would have to adapt it for that environment????? How am i changing the experiment????

Why, because i think that in order to use JKD in a cage you would have to adapt it for that environment????? How am i changing the experiment????Let's break this down.

We have the ninja attack (brick???) experiment.
We have the street vs Cage debate experiment.
We have the multiple opponent vs the ground experiment.

Now, that have I broken it down into the basic elements, have you figured out where you have failed?

Why, because i think that in order to use JKD in a cage you would have to adapt it for that environment????? How am i changing the experiment????


JKD in the cage has been used it looks exactly like MMA

Your problem is you haven't cross trained (I assume) and don't recognize whats going on.

For example Bj Penn likes fake going for a single where he drops down and starts to lunge at the leg he then throws a loopy haymaker.

Why

Because if the person starts to sprawl to stop the shot there guard comes down and they don't see the haymaker.

If they see the hay maker and move back and bring there hands up they leave them selves open for the takedown.

They BJ Penn Loopy Haymaker is in fact a very clever and technical strike with several components to it.


Also Eric Paulson started of in JKD and incorporates it into his MMA.

again in caps

JKD TRAINED FOR MMA LOOKS JUST LIKE MMA

Let's break this down.

We have the ninja attack (brick???) experiment.
We have the street vs Cage debate experiment.
We have the multiple opponent vs the ground experiment.

Now, that have I broken it down into the basic elements, have you figured out where you have failed?

Those are all one thing. The scenario is you are fighting someone, and you either take it to the ground or you dont.

A. You do, and Vinnie runs around the corner and knocks you out with a brick.

B. You dont, instead you kick the guy in the knee when he attacks you and deck him in the face with a hard rear left and KO him. Then Vinnie runs around the corner with a brick. At that point it depends on who reacts first. The difference here is that there is at least some probability that you will be able to react and do something about Vinnie running around the corner with a brick, i.e. Kick him in the balls and then grab his head and slam it into your knee strike, whereas sitting on the ground in the mount you'll just get cracked in the side of the head.

Which leads to the Street Vs. Cage thing. In the cage, you wont have to worry about vinnie with a brick, so Grappling is more of a concern.

But like i said, you still need grappling in case you end up on the ground when you're in a streetfight. The only difference is that in the street your object is to get back to your feet, not stay on the ground looking for an armbar for who knows how long.

i'm just saying that it's a really good system and i'd like it to be represented correctly.


I had always thought JKD's philosophy was using what works, and to throw away crap.

Which is why you don't see a lot of the triangulating chain punchery.

Admit your love for the chun. Head over to the Boztepe vs. Lesnar thread, and indulge. Don't fight who you really are!

Those are all one thing. The scenario is you are fighting someone, and you either take it to the ground or you dont.

A. You do, and Vinnie runs around the corner and knocks you out with a brick.

B. You dont, instead you kick the guy in the knee when he attacks you and deck him in the face with a hard rear left and KO him. Then Vinnie runs around the corner with a brick. At that point it depends on who reacts first. The difference here is that there is at least some probability that you will be able to react and do something about Vinnie running around the corner with a brick, i.e. Kick him in the balls and then grab his head and slam it into your knee strike, whereas sitting on the ground in the mount you'll just get cracked in the side of the head.

Which leads to the Street Vs. Cage thing. In the cage, you wont have to worry about vinnie with a brick, so Grappling is more of a concern.

But like i said, you still need grappling in case you end up on the ground when you're in a streetfight. The only difference is that in the street your object is to get back to your feet, not stay on the ground looking for an armbar for who knows how long.


Please identify the independent/dependent variables for me in your experiment.


AND GOD KNOWS HOW LONG IT TAKES TO FIND ARMBARS! AMEN BROTHER LOLOLOLOLOL THOSE UNTRAINED GRAPPLING OPPONENTS ARE SO DAMN TRICKY

JKD in the cage has been used it looks exactly like MMA

Your problem is you haven't cross trained (I assume) and don't recognize whats going on.

For example Bj Penn likes fake going for a single where he drops down and starts to lunge at the leg he then throws a loopy haymaker.

Why

Because if the person starts to sprawl to stop the shot there guard comes down and they don't see the haymaker.

If they see the hay maker and move back and bring there hands up they leave them selves open for the takedown.

They BJ Penn Loopy Haymaker is in fact a very clever and technical strike with several components to it.

JKD TRAINED FOR MMA LOOKS JUST LIKE MMA


Not a bad move, i might add. Good example of Progressive Indirect Attack.

But why does JKD trained for MMA have to look just like MMA? Why dont they Intercept with the Straight lead? No fencing influence, No Corkscrew hooks, No shovels,or Power side forward... If they were really using JKD then why dont we see guys moving in to strike and getting intercepted with sidekicks to the legs and stuff like that. Not once have i seen someone go to hit and get KO'd with an intercepting Straight Lead Right. Not even an Attempt at it.

Even if MMA guys fight with their right hand in fron, they only use their lead weapons as set-ups, not power shots to intercept.