Fair review of RDS. Few things...their guy isn't the top Krav Maga instructor in Arizona, he is just the head instructor for their schools. Also, everything you described about Tactical Black is part of Krav Maga, they've just taken out some of the "cooler" stuff and put it into a different program so that they can charge more for it.

Have you trained at RDS?
If so, you should know, they do peg Ackerman as the head Krav guy for Arizona.

Tactical Black is closer to Kickboxing and submission wrestling than Krav.

And also Hammerfists, what is your opinion on RDS? Am I being over analytical saying that you are getting sort of defensive of REACT? Maybe you train there and are nutriding?

I think you misread me...Definitely not defending RDS at all, I'm not a fan. I have trained there briefly (did a 3 month thing when I moved to AZ) and as much as I love Krav I just couldn't take it anymore there. Great facilities and for fitness I really enjoyed some of the bag classes, but the harassment and heavy handed business tactics were far too much to make it enjoyable. Plus I wanted to do Krav and progress in it, not their own system of Tactical Black but they push the upgrade endlessly. I know a few others who have left for feeling the same way.

I have been training in Krav off and on for over 10 years and have trained in numerous schools. I've also done some Muay Thai and BJJ, but for me the Krav system is the best for what I need out of it...it just can really depend on the school sometimes.

Have you trained at RDS?
If so, you should know, they do peg Ackerman as the head Krav guy for Arizona.

Tactical Black is closer to Kickboxing and submission wrestling than Krav.

And also Hammerfists, what is your opinion on RDS? Am I being over analytical saying that you are getting sort of defensive of REACT? Maybe you train there and are nutriding?

Sorry for being unclear, What I had meant with my original comment that they say he is the head for Arizona (there is no such thing) but they also make a number of other claims in person and on their website that just aren't quite accurate. And my comment about Tactical Black, from everything you described in your review to everything I have witnessed and heard from others who train in it...they have taken elements of Krav Maga out of their Krav program and created a new system they call Tactical Black and then charge people more for it. So the school is really no longer even a Krav Maga school at all, they just use the name and reputation of Krav to get people in the door and then hound them to upgrade to Tactical Black to get the good stuff. They used to have many Krav classes a day on their schedule, and now its like 1 Krav class with multiple Tactical Black classes.

You can get most all the elements of Tactical Black at other Krav schools because it is already part of Krav Maga (except for some of the offensive shooting stuff they have added). For instance the normal Krav curriculum has fairly extensive ground fighting and sparring material in it already.

Sorry for being unclear, What I had meant with my original comment that they say he is the head for Arizona (there is no such thing) but they also make a number of other claims in person and on their website that just aren't quite accurate. And my comment about Tactical Black, from everything you described in your review to everything I have witnessed and heard from others who train in it...they have taken elements of Krav Maga out of their Krav program and created a new system they call Tactical Black and then charge people more for it. So the school is really no longer even a Krav Maga school at all, they just use the name and reputation of Krav to get people in the door and then hound them to upgrade to Tactical Black to get the good stuff. They used to have many Krav classes a day on their schedule, and now its like 1 Krav class with multiple Tactical Black classes.

You can get most all the elements of Tactical Black at other Krav schools because it is already part of Krav Maga (except for some of the offensive shooting stuff they have added). For instance the normal Krav curriculum has fairly extensive ground fighting and sparring material in it already.

How did they harass you? I'm curious. I was harassed by instructors for sparring too hard (at around 60 percent).

Also, which location did you train at?

Finally: Are you supportive then of calling these RDS people frauds?

How did they harass you? I'm curious. I was harassed by instructors for sparring too hard (at around 60 percent).

Also, which location did you train at?

Finally: Are you supportive then of calling these RDS people frauds?

Harassed some by instructors for having learned some of the techniques slightly different from the way RDS teaches them. Also just harassed about upgrading to Tactical Black or into a longer contract than the 3 months I went with. I trained some at the north Phoenix location and some at the Chandler location.

Fraud isn't the word I would go with, as they teach exactly what they say they will and most the time the classes themselves are great especially the fitness classes. Heavy handed and overly aggressive business tactics and not great customer service is what I would say.

Harassed some by instructors for having learned some of the techniques slightly different from the way RDS teaches them. Also just harassed about upgrading to Tactical Black or into a longer contract than the 3 months I went with. I trained some at the north Phoenix location and some at the Chandler location.

Fraud isn't the word I would go with, as they teach exactly what they say they will and most the time the classes themselves are great especially the fitness classes. Heavy handed and overly aggressive business tactics and not great customer service is what I would say.

I was harassed for being a wrestler. I have this "wrestling habit" of whizzering when I sprawl, and that apparently pissed them off beyond belief. It turned a bag class into a lecture on sprawling on the street. If I whizzer and hit the cement mixer,(which can KO someone on the mat) imagine what it would do on the street. I find RDS folks very close minded. And Tactical Black, atleast now, is fraud. They took their "fight" class and moved it into a bunch of Tactical Black classes. Tactical Black emphasises Kickboxing with no clinchwork, no takedowns, and no takedown defense. The groundwork is a joke. "hehe here's a japanese armbar" and then when the lock is applied, I get bitched out for not tapping. If I don't feel it, I am not going to tap. Sorry.

Just saw this thread and I agree that you should find another place to train in Krav Maga. They took what was a really good school with basic and advanced Krav Maga training and about 18 months ago totally screwed it up beyond repair. The advanced Krav Maga and Krav Maga weapons training used to be awesome, we had big classes and the lead instructor in Chandler would really take us through some conventional and very unconventional self defense training. Weapons training was not only taught in the Saturday morning weapons class, it would also be included in Advanced Krav Maga class in almost every session, the edged weapon training I found to be most valuable for possible real life encounters.

Now all you are left with is all levels Krav class which is unfair to both advanced and beginning students, beginning students deserve to train in the basics for several months and test before moving on to training with more advanced students, and more advanced students should not have to train with beginners unless they chose to attend an all levels class.

They consider the tactical black classes to be the new advanced training...please. WTF is this system even about? You have basic sparring with rules and weapons training mixed together, it makes no sense if your primary goal is self defense training. I like to train techniques that I would use if I were attacked, I would not stand there and put up my dukes and have a sparring session with an attacker, I would defend, destroy and escape...That is what advanced Krav Maga training used to be all about before they stopped offering the class.

I love Krav Maga training and I am still bitter about the ridiculous metamorphosis the school has gone through due to the owners desire to promote the "Fight" classes (a.k.a. Tactical Black) and move away from the Krav Maga System altogether.

You do not seem to take into consideration that there are differences between schools. I don't think you can "review" properly between two stiles from just two schools.

It's the school review forum. If this school offered classes in Taijiquan, you would include it in the same review.

Do us all a favor and stop thinking.