How should I mix the two? I'm MA training thrice a week (every other day), and looking to do weights every other other day, except Sunday.

I've read the stickied threads, and looked at some routines. I'm just not quite sure how some of it might interact with all that MA stuff. Like, apparently Starting Strength mightn't work so great, and I could end up trashed for either pursuit, or both if I really go for it.

What's a workable routine for someone in my situation (i.e., continuing with three martial arts, and looking to get stronger)?

You're leaving out a lot of info so I'd need that first to give you any absolutes.

First off how long have you been training? How old are you? Do you have any injuries, new or chronic? Do you intend to compete in MMA? If so do you have any dates set for a fight? What equipment do you have available? Have you had any training in weight lifting or any conditioning systems? Have you spoken with your coach(es) about how to best go about conditioning? If so what did they advise you to do?

You're leaving out a lot of info so I'd need that first to give you any absolutes.

First off how long have you been training? How old are you? Do you have any injuries, new or chronic? Do you intend to compete in MMA? If so do you have any dates set for a fight? What equipment do you have available? Have you had any training in weight lifting or any conditioning systems? Have you spoken with your coach(es) about how to best go about conditioning? If so what did they advise you to do?I'm 27, been training MT and Judo for about a year, give or take. Did some Karate back in the day, but I don't even want to think about that. MMA, I'm new to, and it's just a matter of learning the basics for now - combos, takedowns, submissions, escaping, and so on. Plus some sparring (which the other two also feature, in their own ways).

Doubt I'll ever compete, no, because I'm probably not that hardcore. If I do, it could be in (small time) Judo, if anything. No injuries. No weights training under my belt, nope.

I have a full-featured gym available, with olympic and lighter barbells, dumbbells, kettlebells, benches, racks, weights machines, pullup bars, dip station, treadmills, rowing machines, and stuff I can't even remember. It seems really good, anyway.

Just wanting to be stronger, because the rest of what I'm doing covers things like "conditioning", best I can tell.

Ok I think I know what you're looking for. I would suggest you keep the workouts short and do them on the same days you train. Your off days work on active recovery. Things like yoga or foam roller work. Since your "conditioning" is being seen to by the classes I would suggest you do a low rep high weight program for limit strength and after you build a foundation with this change it up to a ballistic strength program.
Here is what I would suggest;
1. Turkish Getups
2. Deadlift
3. Military Press
4. Pull Ups
Do each exercise for 3 sets of 5 repetitions with 2 minute rest between sets. Only exception to this is the Turkish Getups. Do 6 sets of 3 reps alternating sides so that you do 3 sets on right and left hand sides. Start at a comfortable weight and try to add 5lbs every other workout. In the beginning focus on technique and do not worry about the weight. This program will not leave you overly sore or tired for your regular training but will build a lot of strength.
Turkish Getups Tutorial

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGRBvom4Zrw

Deadlift Tutorial

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kx5SwH9JEDU

Look up tutorials for the military press and pull ups. As far as which tools to use that is up to you. The getups I would suggest you use kettlebells but thats up to you. The deadlift I prefer using a barbell. As for the military press you can pick either the kettlebell or the barbell versions. This program should give you a good start. One last note on warm up. Spend about 30 seconds on a chosen movement for each exercise. This movement should be easy for you to do and take you through the range of motion required for the specific exercise you are doing.

Thats a good program, I would use a kettlebell or dumb bell for the military press as it is a bit safer for the shoulder and you get a little bit more range of motion. If these four exercises are too much per session you could alternate doing a push and pull each time.

Eg. Workout 1 - Turkish getups + deadlifts, Workout 2 - Military press + pullups.

Or reduce volume, through experience 2x5 and 3x3 rep ranges have been best for me. Do not train to failure.

Who the hell says 'thrice'?

English major?

who says "mightn't"?

Anyways, I agree with doing your weights on the same days you train MA. You'll be exhausted at the end of the day, but you will be better able to recover on your off days.

Try doing weights twice a week. If you are training MA mon-wed-fri, do your weights on mondays and fridays. It'll give you lots of recovery time.

Personally I don't like military lifts due to shoulder problems I have, but to each his own. If you have past injuries to your rotator cuff or shoulder impingement, find something else other than overhead lifts.

Personally I think your routine should go something like:

monday:

Bench press 3x6 rep max
1 or 2 shoulder exercises
1 or 2 tricep exercises


Friday:
Chins ups, 3 sets working your way up to 10 reps each set. When you hit 10 GOOD reps for all three sets, either add weight or start moving your hands further apart to start working your lats, working out to a pull up. (youtube this if it didn't make sense).
Seated rows, 3x8rm
Lat pulls down, 3x8rm
Deadliftm, 3x6rm (If you have never done deadlifts before, research them on youtube and start with a lower weight until your form improves)

What your describing sounds like body building. If you are doing pull ups and deadlifts you don't need lap pull downs and seated rows, its redundant. If you're doing pull ups, military presses and turkish get ups than you don't need additional tricep and shoulder work. As for the bench press, I know its a popular exercise but its not terribly useful for anything other than bigger pecs.

Isolation exercises are not a useful training method for anyting outside of rehab and body building.

Stronger pecs are kind of helpful for martial arts.

Also, many people have trouble doing a full pull up because of under strengthed lats. Lat pull downs will help him work up to actually doing pull ups for reps. Pull ups also don't work the rhomboids as much as a seated row. Chin-ups plus these two exercises will help him achieve pull-ups while preventing imbalances from internal rotation. (chin-ups are with your hands close together with thumbs facing in or nuetral, while pull-ups are with hands wide apart and palms facing away from you). He could also replace lat-pulls with barbell rows.


Isolation exercises are not a useful training method for anyting outside of rehab and body building. While I partially agree with this statement, i partially disagree with it also. Some exercises like the traps are difficult to work with combound exercises because other muscles take over, like military press and bench press. If he wants to get the most out of his workout he should actually spend time on the muscles. Adding a few muscles specific movements after doing compound movements is only going to help his smaller muscles. Especially seeing as they don't respond well to the low rep range that you would be using.


Your 4 exercise routine is leaving pretty big imbalances. You are ignoring the chest muscles, under-working the tricep, biceps and rhomboids, and assuming he can do a full pull-up already. Not to mention its boring.

He wanted something to supplament martial arts training, specifically something to build strength. I set him up with how I would go about that. It is a program meant to work the body as a whole not as seperate muscle groups. I would not stay with it indefinitely, no program should be done forever, but it will begin filling in strength deficits and give him a platform to build from. Its meant to be done in a short amount of time and not leaving him unduely sore or tired out for the rest of his martial arts training and I don't care if its fun its training. I don't find curls and rows and endless body part specific programs fun either. I find them bloody tedious and to be a massive time waster that rarely builds useful strength and often leads to over training and muscle pulls.

Now if after a certain amount of time and training he does find specific strength deficits I may suggest some isolation exercises but only until he is capable of performing more complex and useful whole body movements. If he cannot for example perform pull ups than I would think he might mention that at some point in which case I would give him some alternative ideas, none of which involve a lat pull down machine.

If he cannot for example perform pull ups than I would think he might mention that at some point in which case I would give him some alternative ideas, none of which involve a lat pull down machine.

Feel free to mention them.

Your routine doesn't work the chest in any way.

Simple routines are good, and going for compound exercises are much more productive than isolation exercises, but you've gone a little too simple.

The routine does not emphasize the chest it does however involve it. You are going by the body part body building paradigm. I do not prescribe to that paradigm in training. If you really wanted to add a bench press to the routine you could but its not an exercise that I am a fan of. Most people over work the bench press and usually do it wrong. It also has little carry over into combat sports. If I was going to do anything along a front press I'd probably go with something like the 1/4 Getup. Hell you could do push ups if you wanted to.

who says "mightn't"?

Personally I don't like military lifts due to shoulder problems I have, but to each his own. If you have past injuries to your rotator cuff or shoulder impingement, find something else other than overhead lifts.

Personally I think your routine should go something like:

monday:

Bench press 3x6 rep max
1 or 2 shoulder exercises
1 or 2 tricep exercises


Friday:
Chins ups, 3 sets working your way up to 10 reps each set. When you hit 10 GOOD reps for all three sets, either add weight or start moving your hands further apart to start working your lats, working out to a pull up. (youtube this if it didn't make sense).
Seated rows, 3x8rm
Lat pulls down, 3x8rm
Deadliftm, 3x6rm (If you have never done deadlifts before, research them on youtube and start with a lower weight until your form improves)

A bench press is likely to irritate a shoulder injury more than overhead pressing; in fact proper overhead pressing can actually rehab a bad shoulder. Why add weight after 10 reps? The focus is on strength better to focus on lower reps, i.e. 3-5. Also the idea to learn of youtube is horrible advice for a beginner.

Stronger pecs are kind of helpful for martial arts.

Also, many people have trouble doing a full pull up because of under strengthed lats. Lat pull downs will help him work up to actually doing pull ups for reps. Pull ups also don't work the rhomboids as much as a seated row. Chin-ups plus these two exercises will help him achieve pull-ups while preventing imbalances from internal rotation. (chin-ups are with your hands close together with thumbs facing in or nuetral, while pull-ups are with hands wide apart and palms facing away from you). He could also replace lat-pulls with barbell rows.

While I partially agree with this statement, i partially disagree with it also. Some exercises like the traps are difficult to work with combound exercises because other muscles take over, like military press and bench press. If he wants to get the most out of his workout he should actually spend time on the muscles. Adding a few muscles specific movements after doing compound movements is only going to help his smaller muscles. Especially seeing as they don't respond well to the low rep range that you would be using.


Your 4 exercise routine is leaving pretty big imbalances. You are ignoring the chest muscles, under-working the tricep, biceps and rhomboids, and assuming he can do a full pull-up already. Not to mention its boring.

This post is pretty bad with some fact mixed in with horrible advice.

Still pondering the advice here.

Guess I mainly want a really strong "core" (i.e., everything excluding head, neck, arms and legs), in particular "posterior chain" I think they call it, and also decently strong legs and arms. Enough to get by. Actually, a strong neck wouldn't hurt either.

But then, a good amount of muscle mass all over could be advantageous, anyway, for a whole lot of reasons. Remember, not trying to make weight for competitions, or whatever.

I like the sound of turkish getups, pullups and deadlifts. Everything else, I'm not totally sure. Guess I'll see what else I can dig up from wherever.

Yeah, I can do a few pullups at this stage.

I don't care if routines are "boring" - I'm doing this for strength, not entertainment, ffs.

And "thrice" follows "once" and "twice", children! Try reading something, once in a while.